CSISD proposed boundary adjustments [Second Staff Warning on OP]

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MTTANK
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8:05p, 4/22/18
AG
I can appreciate all the folks compelled to prove their addition and subtraction abilities here, but maybe they are missing the real message. #fatefor58 is using the numbers the school board provided that includes the net number of students(according to them) that would impact their numbers on either side if 8th graders were grandfathered. I'm not a mathologist by any stretch, but I'm pretty sure no one has the correct numbers anyways. If you really want to focus your energy arguing numbers instead of honoring these students cause, you might want to give a little more depth to your math. The numbers everyone is using is what was provided by the school board. Lets assume these are the real numbers, which historically has not been the case. Is it really "around 200 total students"? I get the complex math of adding two numbers. Can you tell me if any of these 8th graders have parents that work full time for the district, bc if so they do not count. Can you tell me if any of these 8th graders are in a culinary or other program that allows choice of school anyways? Maybe we can start our own mathematical argument thread on this subject and argue what we don't know? I can promise you the numbers are not 100% correct either way. There is a talented 8th grade quarterback that was rezoned according to the boundaries voted on Thursdays meeting. Our school board was informed of this on Friday by a coach, and were able to find out that the map was "wrong" on Thursday and that it was a mistake. This single street has now been excluded from the rezone, to fix the "mistake". So we are at least off by one student at the least. How about we use the 58 number that represents BOTH SCHOOLS, and call it close enough.
GIG 'EM
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MTTANK
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In reply to Oogway • 8:13p, 4/22/18
AG
Nice post Oogway, I could not agree more. In a roughly 4000 student high school population, how does 58 skew your populations or precious "demographics" either way? Lets just show these 8th graders a little respect. No one deserves to register for classes and try out for cheer or band, and then be told to start over at this time of the school year. I would urge the school board to put the 58 or so student burden on their shoulders, considering this poor timing for the rezone was their doing and not these students. Maybe they will read this post before they enjoy their bald eagle steak dinner tonight, and do whats right for someone other than themselves. But I'm not holding my breath.
GIG 'EM
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Oogway
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In reply to MTTANK • 8:30p, 4/22/18
I am a proponent of *comparable composition of student bodies, but I believe in setting that aside in this matter because as this discussion has evolved, it is somewhat like the last boundary adjustment where it just made common sense to include those students (or at least give them the choice). I think the school board wrestled with some tough scenarios but doing this would give those families affected by the late decision some closure prior to the end of the semester.

*my summer reading list has gotten a lot heavier as I will now be wading through the two books recommended here plus the extensive reviews. (As an aside, no I hadn't read John Hattie. It was a 200+ page book and it is tax season and yes I skimmed the description and reviews that were both favorable and not so much which is why I am delving deeper. ) I was not an education major in college, this may take awhile...
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91_Aggie
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9:23p, 4/22/18
AG
Here's a school of thought. /tinfoil hat style

It has always been the plan to grandfather the "58" but they were/are going to wait until the people affected got so worked up and demanded the change, and then school board would come back and say "You are right. This was a tough decision but we are going to allow these "58" to choose."

Everyone thinks they won big but now that there was this "win" the school board avoids the slippery slope of "but since my 8th grader has younger siblings, they need to be grandfathered as well"

Everyone affected would have been so excited that they won the small battle, they don't even care about the rest of it. And it actually takes attention away from that silly map with the island of blue in the middle of it.
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TAMU1990
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In reply to MTTANK • 7:32a, 4/23/18
AG
MTTANK said:
I can appreciate all the folks compelled to prove their addition and subtraction abilities here, but maybe they are missing the real message. #fatefor58 is using the numbers the school board provided that includes the net number of students(according to them) that would impact their numbers on either side if 8th graders were grandfathered. I'm not a mathologist by any stretch, but I'm pretty sure no one has the correct numbers anyways. If you really want to focus your energy arguing numbers instead of honoring these students cause, you might want to give a little more depth to your math. The numbers everyone is using is what was provided by the school board. Lets assume these are the real numbers, which historically has not been the case. Is it really "around 200 total students"? I get the complex math of adding two numbers. Can you tell me if any of these 8th graders have parents that work full time for the district, bc if so they do not count. Can you tell me if any of these 8th graders are in a culinary or other program that allows choice of school anyways? Maybe we can start our own mathematical argument thread on this subject and argue what we don't know? I can promise you the numbers are not 100% correct either way. There is a talented 8th grade quarterback that was rezoned according to the boundaries voted on Thursdays meeting. Our school board was informed of this on Friday by a coach, and were able to find out that the map was "wrong" on Thursday and that it was a mistake. This single street has now been excluded from the rezone, to fix the "mistake". So we are at least off by one student at the least. How about we use the 58 number that represents BOTH SCHOOLS, and call it close enough.
No one should be able to go to the board the next day to inquire about an athlete, or any student. I doubt it happened that way. My guess is that a boundary line was right by his house and when the detailed maps came out it became clarified. It does matter which street is used to draw the boundary.
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MTTANK
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7:39a, 4/23/18
AG
That's a great point Wendy! Maybe it can be "explained away" by the school district. I'm not so sure my posts focus was this one incident at all. It was much more about the 8th grade students that are being turned upside down by our school board. But, I appreciate all your compassion for these kids and families that have been wronged by our school board and superintendent.
GIG 'EM
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JR Ewing
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11:46a, 4/23/18
AG
Quote:
When you say the fate of the 58. Don't you really mean the fate of 58 that are going to Consol from previously CSHS. What about the others that are previously zoned for Consol and now are going to CSHS or does that not matter? Because if it doesn't matter of those then the idea of the fate of 58 is honestly an elistest thought. More than 58 are affected but people are focusing on the ones that get the "bad school" and should have gotten the "good school".

I think they should have grandfathered as well and disagree with their ruling but the Fate of 58 is elitist and self serving to not include all that are affected
Not trying to be elitist or self serving. I was talking about the net because I don't know the actual numbers to and from both school and did not want to put out misleading information.

Secondly, I have the right to be self serving and voice my opinion as someone affected by the rezoning who was not afforded an opportunity to speak at a public hearing after they added our neighborhood and did not provide the ability to discuss it with me face to face (off of soapbox).

At the very least, the 8th graders, of which I do not have one, should be grandfathered, IMO. I have neighbors directly affected who have spent money on uniforms already and I think the boards should put the welfare of the kids above their policies, when possible. My kids are young enough to not be affected right now by all of this, and based on all that I've read, I fully expect this all to be revisited in the next 3-5 years, so I'll just wait and see for now.

I don't see why anyone would argue against grandfathering the 8th graders, and even hardships associated with siblings and travel to one school, as it's not going to be a whole lot of people affected who fit those criteria.
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jac4
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In reply to MTTANK • 3:31p, 4/23/18
AG
MTTANK said:



There is a talented 8th grade quarterback that was rezoned according to the boundaries voted on Thursdays meeting. Our school board was informed of this on Friday by a coach, and were able to find out that the map was "wrong" on Thursday and that it was a mistake. This single street has now been excluded from the rezone, to fix the "mistake".


I heard about that too. Sounds like the board didn't consult with the coaches prior to rezoning. I'm sure athletic ability trumps even low or high SES in reasoning priorities.

I'm highly skeptical of any bologna explanation from CSISD about this issue. In any event, kids all over town are talking about it, so the perception of impropriety is already there.
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Stupe
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In reply to JR Ewing • 4:06p, 4/23/18
S
JR Ewing said:
Quote:

I don't see why anyone would argue against grandfathering the 8th graders, and even hardships associated with siblings and travel to one school, as it's not going to be a whole lot of people affected who fit those criteria.
It seems like there are only five people in the entire district that think it's a good idea.
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ZFG
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In reply to Stupe • 6:05p, 4/23/18
Make that 6....wouldn't want to leave out the superintendent who clearly wasn't supporting the district's eighth graders!
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Three Twenties and A Ten
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11:38a, 4/24/18
AG
From a very reliable source...another highly regarded athlete in one of the "rezoned to Consol neighborhoods" that should start on a varsity CSHS team as a freshman next year, has received an "exception to the rezone" and will continue to attend CSHS. Realizing they can "go to CSHS" in 2018-19 school year, but the "approval" has already been issued for them to stay there for all 4yrs.

Guess we can lower the "fate for 58" to "56".
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techno-ag
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In reply to Three Twenties and A Ten • 11:39a, 4/24/18
AG
csag97 said:
From a very reliable source...another highly regarded athlete in one of the "rezoned to Consol neighborhoods" that should start on a varsity CSHS team as a freshman next year, has received an "exception to the rezone" and will continue to attend CSHS. Realizing they can "go to CSHS" in 2018-19 school year, but the "approval" has already been issued for them to stay there for all 4yrs.

Guess we can lower the "fate for 58" to "56".
So there's an athletic exception, evidently.
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Stupe
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11:45a, 4/24/18
S
They could have saved themselves, and the parents, a lot of headaches by doing the right thing for the 8th graders in the first place. If the injunctions or recall election efforts actually happen, this is going to be an expensive decision for the school district.
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Stupe
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In reply to techno-ag • 11:46a, 4/24/18
S
techno-ag said:
csag97 said:
From a very reliable source...another highly regarded athlete in one of the "rezoned to Consol neighborhoods" that should start on a varsity CSHS team as a freshman next year, has received an "exception to the rezone" and will continue to attend CSHS. Realizing they can "go to CSHS" in 2018-19 school year, but the "approval" has already been issued for them to stay there for all 4yrs.

Guess we can lower the "fate for 58" to "56".
So there's an athletic exception, evidently.
Not by name.....
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jac4
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In reply to Three Twenties and A Ten • 11:47a, 4/24/18
AG
csag97 said:
From a very reliable source...another highly regarded athlete in one of the "rezoned to Consol neighborhoods" that should start on a varsity CSHS team as a freshman next year, has received an "exception to the rezone" and will continue to attend CSHS. Realizing they can "go to CSHS" in 2018-19 school year, but the "approval" has already been issued for them to stay there for all 4yrs.

Guess we can lower the "fate for 58" to "56".


Which sport? I assume basketball. Football and Baseball at CSHS would probably be pretty difficult to crack the starting rosters as a freshman.

I think these two examples and exceptions show this whole thing was a dog and pony show. I'm extremely disappointed in CSISD. I'm glad my kids don't go there, but my taxes do. I'll be voting against any future bonds if this is the way they elect to do business.
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Agmaker
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In reply to jac4 • 12:13p, 4/24/18
Yeah. The Board seems to think that since this HS rezone will net an increase of 58 children to Consol that will make the community feel better about approving a bond. Not sure the community is agreeable with that.
Edit spelling.
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Tigermom84
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1:53p, 4/24/18
AG
We are gonna need a lot of countdown numbered hashtags if they grandfather one by one starting with athletes and then dancers and then band members and then siblings, then non siblings, then blonde kids then brunette kids...
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Three Twenties and A Ten
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In reply to jac4 • 2:09p, 4/24/18
AG
jac4 said:
csag97 said:
From a very reliable source...another highly regarded athlete in one of the "rezoned to Consol neighborhoods" that should start on a varsity CSHS team as a freshman next year, has received an "exception to the rezone" and will continue to attend CSHS. Realizing they can "go to CSHS" in 2018-19 school year, but the "approval" has already been issued for them to stay there for all 4yrs.

Guess we can lower the "fate for 58" to "56".


Which sport? I assume basketball. Football and Baseball at CSHS would probably be pretty difficult to crack the starting rosters as a freshman.

I think these two examples and exceptions show this whole thing was a dog and pony show. I'm extremely disappointed in CSISD. I'm glad my kids don't go there, but my taxes do. I'll be voting against any future bonds if this is the way they elect to do business.


I wouldn't feel comfortable saying which sport until it's 100% confirmed, but to your observation, there are several freshman on the Varsity baseball team this year @ CSHS and they have several pitchers that have been on the team and starting since freshman year. Basketball and track are typically where you also see that jump being capable of being made. You're right regarding football, though.
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Three Twenties and A Ten
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In reply to jac4 • 2:10p, 4/24/18
AG
jac4 said:
csag97 said:
From a very reliable source...another highly regarded athlete in one of the "rezoned to Consol neighborhoods" that should start on a varsity CSHS team as a freshman next year, has received an "exception to the rezone" and will continue to attend CSHS. Realizing they can "go to CSHS" in 2018-19 school year, but the "approval" has already been issued for them to stay there for all 4yrs.

Guess we can lower the "fate for 58" to "56".


Which sport? I assume basketball. Football and Baseball at CSHS would probably be pretty difficult to crack the starting rosters as a freshman.

I think these two examples and exceptions show this whole thing was a dog and pony show. I'm extremely disappointed in CSISD. I'm glad my kids don't go there, but my taxes do. I'll be voting against any future bonds if this is the way they elect to do business.


And, yes, it was a complete dog-and-pony show....
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Oogway
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In reply to jac4 • 2:16p, 4/24/18
jac4 said:
csag97 said:
From a very reliable source...another highly regarded athlete in one of the "rezoned to Consol neighborhoods" that should start on a varsity CSHS team as a freshman next year, has received an "exception to the rezone" and will continue to attend CSHS. Realizing they can "go to CSHS" in 2018-19 school year, but the "approval" has already been issued for them to stay there for all 4yrs.

Guess we can lower the "fate for 58" to "56".


Which sport? I assume basketball. Football and Baseball at CSHS would probably be pretty difficult to crack the starting rosters as a freshman.

I think these two examples and exceptions show this whole thing was a dog and pony show. I'm extremely disappointed in CSISD. I'm glad my kids don't go there, but my taxes do. I'll be voting against any future bonds if this is the way they elect to do business.
Wouldn't assume that the sport is basketball; starting roster is irrelevant. Not necessarily in this District, but I've witnessed coaches get rather possessive about athletes they feel entitled to.



But you are correct: it is a show.
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CS78
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In reply to Stupe • 2:33p, 4/24/18
Stupe said:
...recall election.....


Did I miss something? Details?
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Stupe
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9:47p, 4/24/18
S
Just comments that have been made at a couple of youth activities that I've been at since the vote. The 8th grader thing has made people from both schools mad even if they don't have an affected kid.
I personally wouldn't start something like that, but there are people that are talking about it.
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maddiedou
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11:27p, 4/24/18
AG
I posted this on the other thread too...

I was informed that the board members haven't really received many concerned emails over grandfathering 8th graders.

If you support grandfathering, you need to email them individually, tell them how you feel about it in a respectful way and ask them to add it to the agenda for the May 15th board meeting so they can officially discuss reconsideration of the issue.

michaelshaefer@csisd.org
mikenugent@csisd.org
carolbarrett@csisd.org
michaelwesson@csisd.org
jeffharris@csisd.org
quinnwilliams@csisd.org
geralyn.nolan@csisd.org
cealy@csisd.org
news@kbtx.com
news@wtaw.com
news@theeagle.com

Many on this thread have expressed your belief that grandfathering the 8th graders is the right thing to do so let your voices be heard.

Edit to add news outlet emails
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MTTANK
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In reply to maddiedou • 9:21a, 4/25/18
AG
maddiedou said:
I posted this on the other thread too...

I was informed that the board members haven't really received many concerned emails over grandfathering 8th graders.

If you support grandfathering, you need to email them individually, tell them how you feel about it in a respectful way and ask them to add it to the agenda for the May 15th board meeting so they can officially discuss reconsideration of the issue.

michaelshaefer@csisd.org
mikenugent@csisd.org
carolbarrett@csisd.org
michaelwesson@csisd.org
jeffharris@csisd.org
quinnwilliams@csisd.org
geralyn.nolan@csisd.org
cealy@csisd.org

Many on this thread have expressed your belief that grandfathering the 8th graders is the right thing to do so let your voices be heard.
I would also be sure to copy these folks on your emails, just to help keep count. Also if you have sent emails already please resend them to these folks :

kehall@kagstv.com
news@wtaw.com
Oder@kbtx.com
news@theagle.com

I have been told that the board is not getting any response about the 8th graders as well. My initial response was that there was no way people are not littering their emails. After I think about it, I am pretty sure the emails have slowed. I think after all the emails that were sent in the rezoning process, people watched them disregard it and continue with exactly what they wanted. I think the better part of the entire community has lost all faith in our superintendent and school board. A number of parents did email yesterday after hearing this, and received copy and paste responses form Jeff Harris noting he "does not have time to respond to individuals". Wesson stands shoulder to shoulder with Harris, and from the things I have heard about his behavior he might even be toxic in this situation. Hard to imagine TAMU Mays business school does not have a problem being represented by Wesson in this matter. Also our superintendent Mr. Ealy took the time to call these parents, and assure them how much they were going to enjoy this school change(grab you ankles folks). No regard for families or these students.

I have been made to believe if they get enough emails they will put 8th graders back on the agenda and take another look . The only real message I see in all of this is that our superintendent and school board are imposing their will on College Station. They have now told Both high schools that they are to bus these 8th graders to the newly zoned schools on May 11th and exert pressure on the students to register for 9th grade there. This has been mandated to the counselors and coach's, etc. If they scheduled this for may 11th, what does that tell you about their intentions to grandfather these disrespect 8th graders???
GIG 'EM
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Oogway
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In reply to MTTANK • 9:31a, 4/25/18
I wouldn't discontinue emails, I think it is a good idea to continue them. With respect to the form reply, I will say that quite some time ago I sat and observed a workshop and later a friend of mine did likewise (it's a good plan if your subdivision has a group to trade off and exchange notes so everyone is informed but the same one person doesn't have to be the one to always go.)

Anyway, apparently the Board isn't supposed to comment individually (like speak on behalf of the Board) or something like that. We may have gotten that wrong though. I know the last time I emailed them, I cc'd it to several people and it was actually someone in Administration that drew the short straw in replying to me.
Hope that helps, and good luck.
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Agmaker
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2:32p, 4/30/18
I guess everyone is aware there Will be rezoning next year for the new elementary. My guess is that's going to create a domino effect and the Board will be right back at looking at middle, intermediate and HS once again. No strategic long term plan.
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Oogway
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In reply to Agmaker • 4:06p, 4/30/18
Perhaps, but elementaries are sometimes not quite as contentious depending on location since the capacities are different. That one is on the west side, so perhaps it will be mostly students who have been crossing Wellborn can now stay closer to home?
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ZFG
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In reply to Oogway • 5:40p, 4/30/18
But keep in mine that Pebble Creek elementary is WAY under capacity so that's going to create a ripple effect too!
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Wicked Good Ag
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6:00a, 5/1/18
Rezoning at the elementary school level is usually done towards proximity. While a elementary school may occasionally be split in half at the next level the ripple effect isn't near as bad as the high school level. Going from one high school to two high schools has got to be the toughest rezone. They didn't plan as properly as they should have the first time based on expected numbers. But CSHS will be over capacity or at capacity for years to come until the second phase is built on the school. Consol got too big even with portables before the split.
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L84Life
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In reply to Wicked Good Ag • 8:50a, 5/1/18
Usually done for proximity? Well, from my memory, CSISD zoned a large complex off Southwest Parkway to Pebble Creek, not to their closest school or to the school that all the surrounding houses were zoned for. They will rezone elementary schools when the new campus opens, however, it is mind blowing that the last elementary school opened just a few years ago, a rezoning occurred then, and we currently have one school only 67% full and one at 117% capacity and another at 114% capacity.

Also, if you read FC Local, I think we might be in for another round for the intermediate/middle school rezoning sooner than people realize. In the same presentation presented in the Fall that kicked this High School thing off, the current intermediate schools (Oakwood and Pecan Trail) have a comparability variance of 20%. For intermediate/middle if the difference of EDA students is greater than 15% points, they are not considered to be comparable composition. Again mind blowing. In 2016, the predictions shared with the board and community were that Oakwood would be 36%ED, Cypress 35%, and Pecan 36%. Yet, in 2017, they were really: Oakwood at 43%, Cypress 34%, and Pecan 23%. If I were the board, I would be asking, why? What changed in one year? Because these schools will be feeders into the middle schools, this will also impact those next year when the new middle school opens. And to note, currently AMCMS and CSMS have a 20% difference too. A lovely domino effect. So, they opted to not address this in the fall when the numbers were shared, but chose to focus first on the high school whose variance was only 2% greater than the magic number in the FC Local. High school level the variance was 14% compared to the FC Local comparable percent of 12%.

And finally, the FC Local policy allows for the administration/board to leave things as status quo, or to recommend if boundaries should be adjusted. So, there is no forcing of the lines, it really is up to the administration to advise the board as to what they want. All very interesting...
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Agmaker
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10:42a, 5/1/18
This HS rezone was merely supported by a comment from the Admin that stated the only way to manage current Over Capacity and Compa Variance is to rezone. No detailed discussion on options available to the Admin. It seemed like Admin just said what the Board wanted to hear. This has been a total disaster. The Board didn't even understand the numbers that the Admin gave them regarding rezone. And now this PR nightmare. All this rezoning aggravation for a net increase at Cons of 58 or less. It is a thankless job but if they'd think outside the box, put a strategic zoning plan in place and throw the arbitrary FC Local out they'd get more praise. Instead they just try to dictate as an all knowing higher power and split the community apart.
Edit spelling
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Oogway
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8:51a, 9/28/18
Rather than start a new thread, here is information regarding the upcoming boundary adjustment for River Bend Elementary (#10):

Monday, October 1 at 6:00 pm ---Board Workshop (different scenarios presented by Administration)

Wednesday, October 3 at noon --Public Hearing (Public gives feedback)

Thursday, October 4 at 5:30 pm ---Public Hearing (More Public feedback)


There are more workshops scheduled after that first week, but as far as I know, no additional public hearings. All meetings are held in the CSISD Boardroom.


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MTTANK
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11:24a, 9/28/18
AG
Thanks for the update Oogway! For this rezone, they have stated they do not plan on relying on "comparability". This is because they are rezoning for pebble creek. When zoning for Consol, they needed to use "comparability" to send the most expensive neighborhoods to Consol. Now that pebble creek elementary is up for rezone, they want to only feed it with more affluent neighborhoods. Of course, this would go against zoning for "comparability". So they plan to throw that metric out the window for the most part, which was so important when rezoning Consol. I am pretty sure they will spin it by saying they are trying to be responsive to those that were so upset with last rezoning being based only on comparability. In the end, they are up to bat for Pebble Creek Elementary here, as they were up to bat for Consol HS in the last rezoning. I think Indian Lakes is on the chopping block here, among others. They will also spin it as being financially responsible, they are filling up the under capacity pebble creek elementary and saving the tax payers money. Sad thing is they are not smart enough to even have accurate numbers, as we saw in the last rezone. The vast majority of Indian Lakes has pulled their elementary aged students from csisd, and put them in the new charter school. Obviously parents did this because they knew the district would continue to hack away at the map. They also will be zoning the saddlle creek area to the new river bend elementary. There is 5 other elementary schools closer to that area then River Bend. Awesome being in a district that does not believe in school choice, or even remotely honor proximity unless it helps the schools boards personal agenda.
GIG 'EM
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Oogway
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3:41p, 9/28/18
Please be more specific. When you say "they,' do you mean the school board? Administrators? When and who made this statement regarding comparability and the upcoming boundary adjustment?

The workshop in August discussed the timeline for the boundary adjustment meetings (as in what day and times the Board would meet and when public hearings would be held.)
The only other comments that I heard were regarding making sure there was an email address for feedback, getting the word out for the dates for the public to comment, and lastly to reiterate that this was K-4 zoning only and in addition, Harris (I think) asked that they include any grandfathering scenarios in the initial scenarios so as to be transparent.

The workshop in September pretty much was the motion to approve of the timeline for the meeting dates. No neighborhoods were mentioned, no statistics, no capacity, nada.

Anything that involves education and children gets people riled up, so unless you have specific sources, can you please try to stick to the facts that are verifiable?
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jac4
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4:21p, 9/28/18
AG
Their unstated goal is for Saddle Creek and Duck Haven to be zoned to the new elementary. I guess by "they" I mean the school board and CSISD administration.
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