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Outdoor fire monitoring?

1,476 Views | 18 Replies | Last: 2 yr ago by denied
GunRangeGal
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AG
We just bought a house up in the mountains, in a remote-ish area. Unfortunately, the above ground powerlines are closer to us than we'd like. We're being overly cautious, but we would like to detect a fire sooner rather than later… Especially since we both commute to the city meaning we are away from the house for long at the time. Most of our neighbors don't live there full-time, so I think we would be the first to notice anything amiss.

Does anybody have an early fire detection system on their property? Something like thermal cameras? How reliable are they? Any input would be greatly appreciated!
Roger That
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For the right price I'll come sit on your patio, stare at the trees looking for smoke (and drink bourbon) whenever you're away from your house.
K_P
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We use something similar in the oil field. I could see it easily running over 10 grand 2 or 3 cameras and the base station, but maybe there is a poor boy solution that I'm not aware of
lazuras_dc
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Any ever see these in action?

GunRangeGal
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When can you start?
GunRangeGal
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Thank you! I figured they might be outrageously expensive.
FamousAgg
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I think your best money would be spent fire proofing the home or property itself. It will protect you if you are home or away.

Some of this stuff is as simple as keeping dead leaves and vegetation away from the home, keeping mesh over any attic vents to keep flying embers out, clearing a fire break around the property. Mor expensive things might be adding a metal roof, replacing siding, special coatings or paints etc.

Here is a good resource https://csfs.colostate.edu/wildfire-mitigation/protect-your-home-property-from-wildfire/

Depending on your commute time l, by the time the fire makes an appearance you may be too late.

normaleagle05
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I'm not directly familiar with it but I'm certain the State of Colorado has a fire monitoring system available to the public. I'd start by getting super good with that as a user and then progress to understanding the data inputs and processing and compare it to other systems around the country. Then see what you can do for yourself to supplement that information within your finer spatial and temporal resolution around your place.
cupofjoe04
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Korbin is 100% correct. This is where you should put your money.

Think about it this way- if you have a camera system that alerts you to a fire, and you are at work- what can you do? The fire is already hot, and is already close enough to your property to be picked up on a camera. All you can do is call the fire department, who I would reckon stands a great chance to already know before you do (and have their resources already deployed where they see best, which may not be your property).

If you invest your money in making your home fire-wise; your property will stand the best chance possible if a fire comes by. It takes work and diligence, but you need to be doing that wether you have a detection system or not. Research how to make your home as fire-wise as possible, and put your efforts there. If you get a fire, even one started on your property, you stand a much better chance of not loosing anything serious.

Just my .02

This is coming from a native Texan who has been living in a Colorado tinderbox (South San Juan's) for 6 years now.
I've never heard of a residence having an early warning system for fires on their place. It's possible someone does, but it certainly isn't something I've ever heard discussed with any builders or contractors I know.
GunRangeGal
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All good points… except we bought a gigantic log cabin. Not exactly the most fireproof material, ha!
normaleagle05
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Ok, this isn't an off-the-shelf solution, and honestly probably requires some community involvement to 1) have the variety and depth of expertise to implement and 2) have the spatial extent and density of observations to be practical, but here goes.

https://hackaday.com/2015/06/05/building-your-own-sdr-based-passive-radar-on-a-shoestring/#more-157857

Using the above and some know how you could build a local network of passive radar stations (RX only, no FCC licensing required) that could be used to detect smoke plumes over a wide area way before the State or the USFS/BLM/other federal land managers triggered any kind of alert system. This would require some expertise but the monetary cost could be kept super low. "Lunch interview with a graduating senior at The Chicken" low.

I'm not saying it's easy, or any substitute for typical fire mitigation strategies, but the tools look to exist.

ETA: This may have some resolution limitations. The same theory could be applied to an optical system, and the software tools are probably much more available and robust. The optical implementation would have more field of view limitations than the radar. But I don't think they would matter too bad in a smoke plume detection role.
Brennan22
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What are y'alls thoughts on permanently setting up sprinklers on the roof of a building as well as around it that can be turned on remotely in case of a fire? Overkill? Effective?
FamousAgg
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Question for the OP.

If you were to know a fire is coming say 4 hours in advance, what do you plan to do? Are you going to fight fire yourself with a garden hose? Do you plan to invest in a firefighting foam system or something more advanced? Are you just wanting to be able to evacuate pets and some possessions?
agnerd
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How far away does your wifi work? You can get battery powered home automation sensors that can send you an alert if the temperature rises above a certain level. You could spread them out around the house as long as teh fire doesn't take out your wifi service before the the sensors.
FamousAgg
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Brennan01 said:

What are y'alls thoughts on permanently setting up sprinklers on the roof of a building as well as around it that can be turned on remotely in case of a fire? Overkill? Effective?

Some issues
You may not have water at the time
You can't necessarily focus water where needed
You are potentially taking water away from firefighters by decreasing pressure unnecessarily. (Imagine everyone doing this at once in a neighborhood)
normaleagle05
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And it does little to mitigate your attic's ventilation system from sucking in airborne embers.

Site fire risk mitigation is about saving property.

Early/imminent warning systems are about saving life.
GunRangeGal
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I couldn't care less about saving the structure or property if there's a major fire. I want time to get my dogs out, clear out the safe, grab important documents, and some important heirlooms. We're putting together a "go bag" for fire season so we can be out quickly. We personally dealt with people being evacuated last year in the largest fire in stage history… so it's much more real to us than before. Probably being paranoid, but hearing how our neighbor's parents had 15 minutes to evacuate their forever home was terrifying.
GunRangeGal
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This sound intriguing! Our wifi is pretty powerful, so I'll have to look into this. Thank you!
rather be fishing
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Defensible space is the #1 priority. Also, hound the electric company to maintain their ROW. They are required to do so. If they won't do it, I'd probably do it myself and then bill them for my time.
denied
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Adding to what everyone else has already said… detection isn't really an effective solution. You need to create defensible space and harden your home. The Colorado State Forest Service is good, another good one is from California (https://www.readyforwildfire.org/).

And while you may a fatalist attitude towards losing your home in the event of a fire because it is a log cabin, if you do things right your house will resist burning. A few years ago a guy in California had the only house around for miles that didn't burn and he got hate mail from his former neighbors. The difference was though he didn't just spend millions of dollars on a home like his neighbors, he spend millions of dollars on a prepared home. I am not saying to spend millions (unless you have that kind of money, do!); just be smart with your home.

-Clear all brush away from the home
-Cut low branches from trees
-keep grasses cut low
-maintain appropriate spacing between all vegetation (vertical and lateral)
-use double (or better triple) paned glass, with a tempered layer
-cover all vents with metal mesh screens
-use a fire resistant material for your roof
-use a metal mesh screen for your chimney and keep the damper closed when not in use

If you do these things it gives you and responders an opportunity to evacuate people and animals, and wrap the home in a fire barrier.

Homes (and communities) need to be built and designed for the environment they are in because nature wins every time you don't!
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