Well.... bye

:-( It's excusable to feel old when a "young" QB retires.

As for his career - he's got two nasty-glorious rings. He's in another universe from 99.9999% of the rest of the NFL QBs.

Patriots fans here in Boston are staring into the abyss - we all know the party's over.

Eli, Rivers, and Big Ben were taken 1-2-3 in the2004 draft. Similar stats for all 3. Manning had incredible durability, but a much lower career completion percentage. For my money, Big Ben was the best of the 3. However, I'd take a healthy Tony Romo, undrafted in 2003, over any of them.

Had a recent debate about Jimmy Johnson. But in the end you ask the question "how many coaches have 2 super bowl rings". Then you realize he's in rare company.

Same for Eli... they're aren't that many QBs with 2 rings.

I despise Eli and don't think he's ever been one of the best QBs in the league. OTOH, its the Hall of Fame not the Hall of Excellence, and between NYC, 15 years, and the SB wins Eli has fame in spades. Especially considering his win against the undefeated Pats and the Tyree catch. Call it the Joe Namath criteria

Nobody has ever made as much money in the NFL as Eli Manning.

How I hope tomorrow goes.

While true, Brees should/will pass him next season.

94chem said:

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Eli, Rivers, and Big Ben were taken 1-2-3 in the2004 draft. Similar stats for all 3. Manning had incredible durability, but a much lower career completion percentage. For my money, Big Ben was the best of the 3. However, I'd take a healthy Tony Romo, undrafted in 2003, over any of them.

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How much of the Eli, Rivers v Big Ben comparison is basically how good the franchise was. (How much is that guy, and how much of their greatness is due to the franchise)?

I would expect that most would rank them Ben, Eli, Rivers, but that's how most would rank the Steelers, Giants, and Chargers in terms of quality of running their franchises, both before and during those qb's time there.

Would Drew Brees career status been the same had he stayed in San Diego? (He certainly was part of a revolution of the Saints franchise).

I don't really care about these three, but it was something I was thinking of during the Packers v Niners pregame. If Alex Smith and Aaron Rodgers had switched draft positions, would Rodgers still be considered awesome after getting beat up and going through a parade of offenses and offensive coordinators and Mike Singletary?

A 3 suck

I've never thought Eli was that great. About the best thing I could say about him is that he didn't **** up a good thing. But I think you could plug into competent QB into those giants teams and they'd have done great too. But of course they wouldn't have had the name pedigree for everyone to fawn over.

Vernada said:

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I've never thought Eli was that great. About the best thing I could say about him is that he didn't **** up a good thing. But I think you could plug into competent QB into those giants teams and they'd have done great too. But of course they wouldn't have had the name pedigree for everyone to fawn over.

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Yeah, plug in any one and they can go 8-3 as underdog in playoffs.

Iowaggie said:

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94chem said:

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Eli, Rivers, and Big Ben were taken 1-2-3 in the2004 draft. Similar stats for all 3. Manning had incredible durability, but a much lower career completion percentage. For my money, Big Ben was the best of the 3. However, I'd take a healthy Tony Romo, undrafted in 2003, over any of them.

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How much of the Eli, Rivers v Big Ben comparison is basically how good the franchise was. (How much is that guy, and how much of their greatness is due to the franchise)?

I would expect that most would rank them Ben, Eli, Rivers, but that's how most would rank the Steelers, Giants, and Chargers in terms of quality of running their franchises, both before and during those qb's time there.

Would Drew Brees career status been the same had he stayed in San Diego? (He certainly was part of a revolution of the Saints franchise).

I don't really care about these three, but it was something I was thinking of during the Packers v Niners pregame. If Alex Smith and Aaron Rodgers had switched draft positions, would Rodgers still be considered awesome after getting beat up and going through a parade of offenses and offensive coordinators and Mike Singletary?

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Rodgers has a faster, more accurate and much stronger arm than Alex Smith. I'd guarantee you if they switched places there wouldn't be a parade of offensive coordinators.

Irish_Man said:

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Whether or not eli belongs in the HOF is an argument that will go on forever but there is no way he gets left out.

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100% this. Dude is in (and I believe he completely deserves it) but I can understand why people would disagree.

Long career in New York, 2 super bowl titles, beat the patriots when they were undefeated. Makes the hall of fame just with that. To me he is Andy Petitte. Should be in the hall of above average. Jim plunkett won 2 Super Bowls and is not in the hall. Nor is his coach that won 2 Super Bowls, Tom Flores.

Eventual HOFer. But not a 1st ballot one.

safety guy said:

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Long career in New York, 2 super bowl titles, beat the patriots when they were undefeated. Makes the hall of fame just with that. To me he is Andy Petitte. Should be in the hall of above average. Jim plunkett won 2 Super Bowls and is not in the hall. Nor is his coach that won 2 Super Bowls, Tom Flores.

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George Seifert & Mike Shanahan also won 2 Super Bowls and aren't in.

ac said:

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safety guy said:

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Long career in New York, 2 super bowl titles, beat the patriots when they were undefeated. Makes the hall of fame just with that. To me he is Andy Petitte. Should be in the hall of above average. Jim plunkett won 2 Super Bowls and is not in the hall. Nor is his coach that won 2 Super Bowls, Tom Flores.

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George Seifert & Mike Shanahan also won 2 Super Bowls and aren't in.

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Blame it on the Bossanova

safety guy said:

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Long career in New York, 2 super bowl titles, beat the patriots when they were undefeated. Makes the hall of fame just with that. To me he is Andy Petitte. Should be in the hall of above average. Jim plunkett won 2 Super Bowls and is not in the hall. Nor is his coach that won 2 Super Bowls, Tom Flores.

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Flores should be in the Hall of Fame no doubt.

and while we're pumping up Eli's playoff record...Jim Plunkett was 8-2 in the playoffs.

for Plunkett's first Super Bowl (1980) run he still had guys from the Madden-Stabler era...Gene Upshaw, Art Shell, and Cliff Branch. But no Marcus Allen yet.

for the second Super Bowl (1983) run he had Marcus Allen, Todd Christensen at TE, and still Cliff Branch. Most of the stars were on defense

Seven Costanza said:

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Strange career. I know he has two Super Bowl MVPs, but I don't think you are a Hall of Fame QB if you were never considered one of the 5 best QBs in the league during any given season. Being consistently slightly above average for 16 seasons is a heck of an accomplishment, but not HoF worthy.

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Agree. Probably never had an MVP vote.

The only major stat Eli ever led the league in was INTs, which he led the league 3x.

Total top 3 rankings in QB Rating, Passing yards, TDs, Yards/Attempt, Completions combined: Once (Passing touchdowns, tied with 4 people for 2nd in 2015.)

Total top 3 rankings in INTs, Pick 6s, and Fumbles: 8.

But those two SB MVPs get him into the HOF.

Multiple Super Bowl MVP winners:
Tom Brady
Joe Montana
Terry Bradshaw
Bart Starr
Eli Manning

Interesting career.

Eli won 8 playoff games in two seasons. He never won a playoff game outside his two Super Bowl runs.

Aikman ?

Bobby Petrino`s Neckbrace said:

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Aikman ?

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has 1

nevermind. Reading comprehension fail.

Eli was great in the playoffs in pressure situations.
Warren Moon and Tony Romo fans wish that could of happened at least once. Don't downplay rising to the occasion....hall of fame definitely

If Eli had the same exact stats, same record and had those 2 SB MVPs, yet did it all with Carolina and was not Peyton's brother, does he get in?

Bruce Almighty said:

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If Eli had the same exact stats, same record and had those 2 SB MVPs, yet did it all with Carolina and was not Peyton's brother, does he get in?

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I've said this before, but I think he's likely even more of a lock in that scenario in a place like Carolina or Buffalo or something vs. New York. Specific to Carolina, there's not much else going on there relative to NY. He'd probably easily be the most prolific athlete ever there and a goddam legend if he led the team for 16 years and had 2 Super Bowl MVP's. I really think his name and city he played in is absolutely more of a detriment to his case and not really the benefit so many people think it is.

Hell, if he did what he's done in Houston and not NY, I think he'd be a bigger deal overall than he's considered right now.

ATM9000 said:

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Bruce Almighty said:

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If Eli had the same exact stats, same record and had those 2 SB MVPs, yet did it all with Carolina and was not Peyton's brother, does he get in?

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I've said this before, but I think he's likely even more of a lock in that scenario in a place like Carolina or Buffalo or something vs. New York. Specific to Carolina, there's not much else going on there relative to NY. He'd probably easily be the most prolific athlete ever there and a goddam legend if he led the team for 16 years and had 2 Super Bowl MVP's. I really think his name and city he played in is absolutely more of a detriment to his case and not really the benefit so many people think it is.

Hell, if he did what he's done in Houston and not NY, I think he'd be a bigger deal overall than he's considered right now.

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I respectfully disagree. If Eli played in Baltimore he would be Joe Flacco with an additional ring.

The overhype as everything to do with his last name, and playing in NYC.