techno-ag said:

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https://www.theverge.com/2024/4/18/24133870/us-air-force-ai-dogfight-test-x-62a

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The US Air Force is putting AI in the pilot's seat. In an update on Thursday, the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA) revealed that an AI-controlled jet successfully faced a human pilot during an in-air dogfight test carried out last year.

DARPA began experimenting with AI applications in December 2022 as part of its Air Combat Evolution (ACE) program. It worked to develop an AI system capable of autonomously flying a fighter jet, while also adhering to the Air Force's safety protocols.

After carrying out dogfighting simulations using the AI pilot, DARPA put its work to the test by installing the AI system inside its experimental X-62A aircraft. That allowed it to get the AI-controlled craft into the air at the Edwards Air Force Base in California, where it says it carried out its first successful dogfight test against a human in September 2023.

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Wowzers. First thought: everyone saying AI can't pilot planes is obviously wrong. They're piloting fighter jets, literally.

Second: this first happened in 2022? They're continuing through 2024 according to the article. Our military is way ahead of everyone else, as usual.

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Until Brandon and Hunter sell our tech!

K2-HMFIC said:

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P.U.T.U said:

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Martin Q. Blank said:

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I thought modern planes and missiles pretty much guaranteed dogfights were a thing of the past.

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The F-35 has much better over the horizon systems that can knock out any other aircraft before they even know its there. But if you can combine that with AI that would be one scary system.

Aircraft have always been designed knowing the limitations of the pilot, take that out and things get even scarier.

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Dogfighting in and of itself is largely antiquated...planes are ultimately a delivery mechanism for a munition.

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They said exactly the same thing in up to 1967 when Migs were killing US fighters at almost 1 to 1. The F-4 Phantoms didn't even have a gun when introduced and often got its ass kicked until the F4-F came out.

Even then they thought dog fighting was "antiquated". They, in fact, created "Top Gun" to fix that massive over sight. The one thing that will make dog-fighting and fighters antiquated is Directed Energy Weapons. Then who knows maybe someone will actually figure out how to build energy shields.

War is always defense vs offence.

F4-F was just a few years earlier.

F-4D (and E) etc. had a gun. The F-35 by comparison can only fire something like 3 2-3 second bursts or it's out of ammo. It all evolves though, yes, and as well in the A2G roles. This is the future of the AH-64/A-10 roles, and why they cancelled the scout replacement again (my opinion):

Minigun-Armed Mojave Drone Now Blasting Targets At 6,000 Rounds Per Minute

This is the first time Minigun pods have been live-fired from a drone in this class and there are already plans to expand on the capability.

Story: https://t.co/vHb2K7HUTr

— Tyler Rogoway (@Aviation_Intel) April 23, 2024

Not exactly a GA/U-7 brrrt but they will get there, in swarms.

Athanasius said:

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Lonely nuclear-powered drones will still be flying autonomously hundreds of years after humans are gone, looking for targets and finding none.

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So a bit like the opening of Interstellar, when that t-sip recovers a drone still flying after many years.

boulderaggie said:

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techno-ag said:

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Madman said:

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In a few more generations the DARPA/Boston Dynamics robots will be capable enough to send into land combat.

If the US Army gets the headsets it wants on actual combat troops those robots will have thousands of hours to learn how to fight with. You know similar to how self driving cars were developed.

Then include facial recognition tech to those fighting robots and........

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For those who don't follow the SpaceX thread...

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I am not as up to date on robot development.

From my original post, how far away do you think we are for combat robots to be ready for use? The hardware anyway. I would assume the software will lag the hardware.

An L of an Ag said:

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You want Skynet?!? Cause this is how you GET Skynet.

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Let's goooooooooooo! I'll be first in line volunteering to time-machine back to the early 80's. Great times. Loved the hair styles and 80's pop culture. Plus I'd get to bang young Linda Hamilton.

Tex117 said:

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Ya know man.....humanity is heading towards some absolutely crazy sheet in the not too distant future.

I'm really glad that Im going to be dust before all of this really goes absolutely insane.

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Your ancestor said same thing, glad he was dust before internet message boards, 'Smart' phones, and all the other social media nonsense (like TexAgs) ruined society.

Martin Q. Blank said:

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I thought modern planes and missiles pretty much guaranteed dogfights were a thing of the past.

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Anybody know how many actual dogfights occurred during the Gulf War?

One……..that's it.

simpsons claimed this back in late 90s/early 2000s

Madman said:

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boulderaggie said:

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techno-ag said:

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Madman said:

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In a few more generations the DARPA/Boston Dynamics robots will be capable enough to send into land combat.

If the US Army gets the headsets it wants on actual combat troops those robots will have thousands of hours to learn how to fight with. You know similar to how self driving cars were developed.

Then include facial recognition tech to those fighting robots and........

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For those who don't follow the SpaceX thread...

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I am not as up to date on robot development.

From my original post, how far away do you think we are for combat robots to be ready for use? The hardware anyway. I would assume the software will lag the hardware.

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We're already there. The Russians sent out an attack wave of tracked drone vehicles with grenade launchers. The Ukrainians hit them with UAV's.

Besides that, there are robot dogs and other concepts that could easily mount weapons or have had weapons platforms tested on them. I don't recall which base it is, but we already have one that is testing a robot dog concept for automated security patrols. Dog goes out and patrols the perimeter on its own in hard to reach places and phones home if there's something suspicious.

hopefully they at least have Norton antivirus on the plane to avoid hacking. Next big govt thought idea will be AI on our nuke missiles.

HDeathstar said:

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hopefully they at least have Norton antivirus on the plane to avoid hacking. Next big govt thought idea will be AI on our nuke missiles.

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"Let's play a game."

ABATTBQ11 said:

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Madman said:

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boulderaggie said:

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techno-ag said:

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Madman said:

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In a few more generations the DARPA/Boston Dynamics robots will be capable enough to send into land combat.

If the US Army gets the headsets it wants on actual combat troops those robots will have thousands of hours to learn how to fight with. You know similar to how self driving cars were developed.

Then include facial recognition tech to those fighting robots and........

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For those who don't follow the SpaceX thread...

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I am not as up to date on robot development.

From my original post, how far away do you think we are for combat robots to be ready for use? The hardware anyway. I would assume the software will lag the hardware.

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We're already there. The Russians sent out an attack wave of tracked drone vehicles with grenade launchers. The Ukrainians hit them with UAV's.

Besides that, there are robot dogs and other concepts that could easily mount weapons or have had weapons platforms tested on them. I don't recall which base it is, but we already have one that is testing a robot dog concept for automated security patrols. Dog goes out and patrols the perimeter on its own in hard to reach places and phones home if there's something suspicious.

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Saw this and thought it was a pretty good write up about how both sides are using drones.

https://www.reuters.com/graphics/UKRAINE-CRISIS/DRONES/dwpkeyjwkpm/

On YouTube. Look up Growling Sidewinders. The do really good simulations of aerial combat. They just recently produced a segment where a F-22 support by 4 drones attack a group of Russian fighters and bombers. It is really cool to watch.

There was a story about ai fighter pilot war/battle game and the ai immediately took out the tower broadcasting limitation controls then easily completed mission task.

Martin Q. Blank said:

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I thought modern planes and missiles pretty much guaranteed dogfights were a thing of the past.

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Wont get fooled again.

FCBlitz said:

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On YouTube. Look up Growling Sidewinders. The do really good simulations of aerial combat. They just recently produced a segment where a F-22 support by 4 drones attack a group of Russian fighters and bombers. It is really cool to watch.

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Thx, they put out a huge volume of videos.

The future of this stuff really is both fascinating and terrifying.

XQ-67 Confirmed To Be A Prototype For General Atomics’ Collaborative Combat Aircraft Design

The XQ-67 gives General Atomics a risk reduction demonstrator that is already flying just as competition to build Collaborative Combat Aircraft heats up.

Story: https://t.co/pVtBHDvBuV

— Tyler Rogoway (@Aviation_Intel) April 26, 2024

It's almost like the USAF wants people to know about this now.

https://apnews.com/article/artificial-intelligence-fighter-jets-air-force-6a1100c96a73ca9b7f41cbd6a2753fda

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An AI-controlled fighter jet took the Air Force leader for a historic ride. What that means for war

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This is a tech demonstrator.

In fact, the USAF just down selected to to collaborative combat aircraft last week.

This isn't anything anyone in DoD wants to hide.

Quote:

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It's almost like the USAF wants people to know about this now.

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Did the interviews and press releases tip you off?

When a rogue AI jet takes out the *******s at Davos, then we will see meaningful change.

GAC06 said:

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Quote:

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It's almost like the USAF wants people to know about this now.

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Did the interviews and press releases tip you off?

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I know, right?

ttu_85 said:

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K2-HMFIC said:

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P.U.T.U said:

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Martin Q. Blank said:

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I thought modern planes and missiles pretty much guaranteed dogfights were a thing of the past.

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The F-35 has much better over the horizon systems that can knock out any other aircraft before they even know its there. But if you can combine that with AI that would be one scary system.

Aircraft have always been designed knowing the limitations of the pilot, take that out and things get even scarier.

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Dogfighting in and of itself is largely antiquated...planes are ultimately a delivery mechanism for a munition.

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They said exactly the same thing in up to 1967 when Migs were killing US fighters at almost 1 to 1. The F-4 Phantoms didn't even have a gun when introduced and often got its ass kicked until the F4-F came out.

Even then they thought dog fighting was "antiquated". They, in fact, created "Top Gun" to fix that massive over sight. The one thing that will make dog-fighting and fighters antiquated is Directed Energy Weapons. Then who knows maybe someone will actually figure out how to build energy shields.

War is always defense vs offence.

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Tech has changed. Missiles in 2024 are not even approaching the same as 1967.

It's like trying to compare the Wright Flyer to an F-35.

nortex97 said:

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FCBlitz said:

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On YouTube. Look up Growling Sidewinders. The do really good simulations of aerial combat. They just recently produced a segment where a F-22 support by 4 drones attack a group of Russian fighters and bombers. It is really cool to watch.

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Thx, they put out a huge volume of videos.

The future of this stuff really is both fascinating and terrifying.

XQ-67 Confirmed To Be A Prototype For General Atomics’ Collaborative Combat Aircraft Design

The XQ-67 gives General Atomics a risk reduction demonstrator that is already flying just as competition to build Collaborative Combat Aircraft heats up.

Story: https://t.co/pVtBHDvBuV

— Tyler Rogoway (@Aviation_Intel) April 26, 2024

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What's really interesting about the new CCA is that the Air Force for the first time ever, down selected to a non-traditional defense company Anduril.

To make this politics related, Palmer Luckey's (Anduril's founder) sister is married to Matt Gaetz.

I think they will eventually skip the ships altogether and have larger drones serve as the carriers for smaller drones. This is already used in Ukraine to augment the range and endurance of smaller drones.

At the strategic level this might look like B-52 sized planes delivering 20 cruise missiles with a 1000 mile range each carrying 75 10lb drones instead of a more traditional 1000 lb warhead.

So the plot of Top Gun 3 is that no human can kill Mav but an AI pilot finally does him in.

Navy gets to the crash site just before Mav goes braindead and downloads his brain via neuralink which is then used to train future AI pilots.

This leads us into Top Gun 4 for which the script will be written and rendered by AI and released a sort time after.

K2-HMFIC said:

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nortex97 said:

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FCBlitz said:

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On YouTube. Look up Growling Sidewinders. The do really good simulations of aerial combat. They just recently produced a segment where a F-22 support by 4 drones attack a group of Russian fighters and bombers. It is really cool to watch.

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Thx, they put out a huge volume of videos.

The future of this stuff really is both fascinating and terrifying.

XQ-67 Confirmed To Be A Prototype For General Atomics’ Collaborative Combat Aircraft Design

The XQ-67 gives General Atomics a risk reduction demonstrator that is already flying just as competition to build Collaborative Combat Aircraft heats up.

Story: https://t.co/pVtBHDvBuV

— Tyler Rogoway (@Aviation_Intel) April 26, 2024

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What's really interesting about the new CCA is that the Air Force for the first time ever, down selected to a non-traditional defense company Anduril.

To make this politics related, Palmer Luckey's (Anduril's founder) sister is married to Matt Gaetz.

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Yea, but Luckey has some fascinating stuff coming out!

I'd like to see Tesla's FSD in an F1 car set to way out of spec full beast mode with other racers on track...

Just to tone down the warmongering machismo a bit....

VitruvianAg said:

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I'd like to see Tesla's FSD in an F1 car set to way out of spec full beast mode with other racers on track...

Just to tone down the warmongering machismo a bit....

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Elon probably already has a system for drones. Space X FSD or something.

Things are pretty tense in the Pentagon these days.

It's not the big stuff that scares me: it's 5,000 bird-sized suicide drones combing the forest at 50mph that scares me.

Soon.

Stat Monitor Repairman said:

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So the plot of Top Gun 3 is that no human can kill Mav but an AI pilot finally does him in.

Navy gets to the crash site just before Mav goes braindead and downloads his brain via neuralink which is then used to train future AI pilots.

This leads us into Top Gun 4 for which the script will be written and rendered by AI and released a sort time after.

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The Navy now has an air launched version of the SM-6 carried by their F18s. That's almost 3x the range of the Phoenix missile carried by the F14's flown in the original Top Gun. It's going to be tough for an AI platform to get an advantage over a human in a dogfight that starts at over 200 miles apart.

Update: https://fortune.com/2024/09/06/defense-tech-startup-anduril-hiring-manufacturing-capacity-us-air-force-fighter-jets/

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In April, the Air Force selected Anduril and surveillance aircraft company General Atomics over Boeing, Lockheed Martin, and Northrop Grumman to design, manufacture, and test unmanned fighter jets that could be implemented into the Air Force fleet. Stephens said on stage that while the timeline will be up to the Pentagon, Anduril needs to "be ready to build hundreds in a couple of years."

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They're like the Tesla of fighter jet manufacturers.