Todd Beamer - Flight 93 Transcript

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PlaneCrashGuy
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thirdcoast said:

SWC Ag said:

He was able to do that with a press that understood the importance of doing so for the sake of the country.
The press today couldn't fathom that. If there was something to be found and be reported on, it would have been.
Especially given it was a Republican administration. Anything that could have been spun as a negative against Bush would have been.


I come in at 80%, not 100%, so I guess that makes me a bad citizen.
"How dare you" they'll say
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$240 Worth of Pudding
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LDA9336 said:

SWC Ag said:

LDA9336 said:

SWC Ag said:

thirdcoast said:

LDA9336 said:

43 shot that plane down


To be honest, everything we have seen with FBI and CIA against Trump has me slightly questioning the validity of the flight 93 story....whereas before, I pretty much accepted it as fact.

Our gov leaders have proven they will let a stolen election stand, push a bogus COVID origin theory, and manipulate public messaging to push vaccines by any means. They lie because they think it's noble and in the public's interest.

I would bet on flight 93 going down the way it's been reported, but also wouldn't be suprised if it was an elaborate smoke screen for a justified military strike. IF it was shot down, we all know telling the truth simply wasn't an option. Bush has plausible deniability as he gave the order to strike, but was then informed of the heroic acts that brought plane down before his order was executed.
The family members that have listened to the tapes have recognized the voices of their loved ones, in particular Tom Burnett's wife said she could pretty clearly hear her husband telling others that he was inured and to continue fighting.

Why would they lie about that?

Of course this is where the conspiracy theorists chime in with "they're lying because they were threatened/paid off/asked to" or "The tapes were faked and played for the family to enhance the psyop on the American people" etc. etc.. There's always another door to open with those folks, nothing's ever good enough.
Perhaps the families want it to be true. Regardless of how it went down, the important part is the victims. We must never forget them and must cherish their memories forever. God bless the USA...
You sully their memory by suggesting it was shot down.
It wasn't a suggestion.
You continue to spit on the memories of those whom you implored us to cherish. Though upon a second reading, I see now that your exhortation was most likely nothing more than derision.

$240 Worth of Pudding
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thirdcoast said:

SWC Ag said:

He was able to do that with a press that understood the importance of doing so for the sake of the country.
The press today couldn't fathom that. If there was something to be found and be reported on, it would have been.
Especially given it was a Republican administration. Anything that could have been spun as a negative against Bush would have been.


The press wasn't anything like it is today, back then during the dial up internet days. The extreme hyperpartisan division today didn't exist back in early 2000s. Also, 9/11 was/is a topic that brought us all together in a good vs evil fight, with flight 93 clearly on the good side.

So back then it would still be suicide for a media outlet to denigrate flight 93 heros. Just like today it's suicide to undermine the integrity of our election process by claiming Dems cheated in 2020.

I'm not saying there is anything to be found that hasn't been found already. Most people here claim 100% certainty based on audio they are told exists, but haven't heard. I come in at 80%, not 100%, so I guess that makes me a bad citizen.
Your memories and mine are very, very different. The internet may not have gifted us social media at that point but the media was every bit as hateful towards Bush as they are towards Republicans now.
aTmAg
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There are witnesses on the ground who saw it go vertical and crash in one piece. The debris was isolated to a tiny area. If it was shot down, it would be spread all over the place.

Don't turn TexAgs into a board of lunatics.
titan
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Once again, think about known cases of frauds and claims. Plenty deployed against Trump the last four years.

Now think of how they sound.

Now consider this narrative from 2001 ---- say again, there are elements there that are not made up. They would not occur to that mindset. You can tell. It also has the right blend of exactly accurate but vague that was all that was known at the time till more was revealed about the plot.
Tibbers
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LDA9336 said:

43 shot that plane down


What's very interesting in the link I posted was Lisa Jefferson talked about how she stayed on the line waiting for it to be disconnected. She said that she got the news the plane had crashed from her colleagues while still on the line waiting for the disconnect. It never happened. She was told to hang up and end the call. Further, the FBI told her to stay quiet about the phone call, not other calls, just that one. It was only after the FBI released their info 3 days after was she authorized to talk about it. Forgive me for not trusting the FBI but their involvement and the entire story just seems…off. In that link as well, Ms. Jefferson talked about how another GTE operator talked with Beamer at first but was distraught and had to pass the call to her. Who was that? Who was the FBI agent that was also on the line?

To get to the truth of the story, one has to look at why the phone never disconnected after the plane crashed. That just doesn't make sense. Maybe the call didn't even happen from the plane? None of it makes sense. Did the Air Force respond to the plane headed toward Washington DC?
PlaneCrashGuy
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Tibbers said:

LDA9336 said:

43 shot that plane down


What's very interesting in the link I posted was Lisa Jefferson talked about how she stayed on the line waiting for it to be disconnected. She said that she got the news the plane had crashed from her colleagues while still on the line waiting for the disconnect. It never happened. She was told to hang up and end the call. Further, the FBI told her to stay quiet about the phone call, not other calls, just that one. It was only after the FBI released their info 3 days after was she authorized to talk about it. Forgive me for not trusting the FBI but their involvement and the entire story just seems…off. In that link as well, Ms. Jefferson talked about how another GTE operator talked with Beamer at first but was distraught and had to pass the call to her. Who was that? Who was the FBI agent that was also on the line?

To get to the truth of the story, one has to look at why the phone never disconnected after the plane crashed. That just doesn't make sense. Maybe the call didn't even happen from the plane? None of it makes sense. Did the Air Force respond to the plane headed toward Washington DC?


All valid questions imo. Personally, I answer them with Occams Razor.
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BluHorseShu
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aTmAg said:

There are witnesses on the ground who saw it go vertical and crash in one piece. The debris was isolated to a tiny area. If it was shot down, it would be spread all over the place.

Don't turn TexAgs into a board of lunatics.
Exactly. It's already teetering
Malachi Constant
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Tibbers
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BluHorseShu said:

aTmAg said:

There are witnesses on the ground who saw it go vertical and crash in one piece. The debris was isolated to a tiny area. If it was shot down, it would be spread all over the place.

Don't turn TexAgs into a board of lunatics.
Exactly. It's already teetering


And yet the very first witness in the video says "I think it was shot down because immediately after it went down a fighter plane flew by"

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3anwb
aTmAg
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Tibbers said:

BluHorseShu said:

aTmAg said:

There are witnesses on the ground who saw it go vertical and crash in one piece. The debris was isolated to a tiny area. If it was shot down, it would be spread all over the place.

Don't turn TexAgs into a board of lunatics.
Exactly. It's already teetering


And yet the very first witness in the video says "I think it was shot down because immediately after it went down a fighter plane flew by"

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3anwb

That means he doesn't know what a plane getting shot down looks like. If it wasn't on fire and in a bunch of pieces, when it was falling, then it wasn't shot down.
Tibbers
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You didn't watch the video.
thirdcoast
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How many times was GWB impeached?

How many times was Trump impeached?

Yeah, they gave Bush the typical Nazi stuff, but what we see today is a whole other level. Not to mention the goal tending for Dems has intensified also.
$240 Worth of Pudding
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thirdcoast said:

How many times was GWB impeached?

How many times was Trump impeached?

Yeah, they gave Bush the typical Nazi stuff, but what we see today is a whole other level. Not to mention the goal tending for Dems has intensified also.
Curious to know your age range. Wondering how "aware" of the political zeitgeist of the day you were (and I don't mean to insult, I'm genuinely curious as, like I stated earlier, my recollection of the media at the time is very different than yours )
I think the Trump impeachment garbage was absolutely aided by social media and the ability to rope in the morons who get their news in soundbites. That stated, the media was absolutely hateful towards W back then and I have no doubt that had they had the ability to rally the idiots as they did with Trump, they'd have done it. Ever since Clinton was impeached, American politics has essentially turned into a game of revenge.
Tibbers
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Yes the media was mean but they didn't try and remove him from office twice. A bit different don't you think?
$240 Worth of Pudding
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Tibbers said:

Yes the media was mean but they didn't try and remove him from office twice. A bit different don't you think?
The media didn't remove Trump from office. The progressive/left/Democrats did. The dishonest media just made it easer. You're setting up a strawman.

Furthermore, you're drifting off course. The original point was a comparison of WWII media to modern media. If you want to argue that the media in 2001 were somehow more closely aligned to the media of WWII than the media of today, you're wasting everyone's time.

**Edited to correct misspellings**
titan
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Yes. You would have to go back to at least 1991 to find the media more aligned with WW II than after. Since then, pretty much since Clinton's inaugural, hopelessly first liberal, then full on Leftist.
PlaneCrashGuy
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SWC Ag said:

Tibbers said:

Yes the media was mean but they didn't try and remove him from office twice. A bit different don't you think?
The media didn't remove Trump from office. The progressive/left/Democrats did. The dishonest media just made it easer. You're setting up a strawman.

Furthermore, you're drifting off course. The original point was a comparison of WWII media to modern media. If you want to argue that the media in 2001 were somehow more closely aligned to the media of WWII than the media of today, you're wasting everyone's time.

**Edited to correct misspellings**
Pot meet kettle.

The argument "United 993 was not shot down because if it was the media would have said so" is preposterous
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titan
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Can agree with that. Its not even close to why don't think it was shot down.
aTmAg
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Tibbers said:

You didn't watch the video.
It's blocked at my work, but my point stands. If he is saying that his evidence that it was shot down was merely that a military jet flew by afterwards, then that is not evidence at all.

It is not hard to tell if a plane got shot down. It's a fireball on the way down. A pressurized airliner would be a lots of burning fireballs on the way down.
PlaneCrashGuy
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titan said:


Can agree with that. Its not even close to why don't think it was shot down.
Would you lay it out for me? How would you debunk or at least respond to the idea that it was?

Its always refreshing to hear from someone who can articulate their thoughts on the matter without standing on the graves of the victims
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titan
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LDA9336 said:

titan said:


Can agree with that. Its not even close to why don't think it was shot down.
Would you lay it out for me? How would you debunk or at least respond to the idea that it was?

Its always refreshing to hear from someone who can articulate their thoughts on the matter without standing on the graves of the victims
There are elements of that story you heard very very soon after the fact. And there are little details and actions that are just thin enough to be exactly right. A hint: forgers can't resist the tendency to spell out--to make sure their read gets it. Think of the Watergate pad on the table in Forrest Gump. That was unnecessary in the context.
$240 Worth of Pudding
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LDA9336 said:

titan said:


Can agree with that. Its not even close to why don't think it was shot down.
Would you lay it out for me? How would you debunk or at least respond to the idea that it was?

Its always refreshing to hear from someone who can articulate their thoughts on the matter without standing on the graves of the victims
Or pissing on them.

Speaking of pots and kettles.
redcrayon
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It wasn't shot down. The ATC recordings are out there.

Also, VP Cheney gave permission to shoot down planes that threatened urban centers, not Bush.
PlaneCrashGuy
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SWC Ag said:

LDA9336 said:

titan said:


Can agree with that. Its not even close to why don't think it was shot down.
Would you lay it out for me? How would you debunk or at least respond to the idea that it was?

Its always refreshing to hear from someone who can articulate their thoughts on the matter without standing on the graves of the victims
Or pissing on them.

"Anyone who does not agree with me is disrespecting the victims and the only way to respect the victims is to agree with me"

ok buddy.

When you're ready to discuss like adults, I'll be here.
“Not gonna lie...its a little disconcerting to have our minister of positivity be PlaneCrashGuy but Im in"
thirdcoast
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I remember the GWB days well enough to know Trump was treated worse. I was late HS and college age back then.

I acknowledge Bush was treated bad, Im just saying that Trump was treated much worse. TDS is another animal. Also, the level of SJW wokeness and cancel culture is worse today then back then.

Do you disagree?
fka ftc
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There are several examples of passenger airlines being shot down by missiles / fighter jets. Not one of them resemble anything like Shanksville. Whereas other crash sites of near vertical impacts at high speed look exactly like the impact crater.

The closest fighter jets were unarmed that morning. Pilots have stated they were willing to crash their jets into the airliner if necessary.

The government lies to us, but I just do not see it in this instance.
"The absence of the word accountability is not the same as wanting no accountability" -unknown

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$240 Worth of Pudding
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LDA9336 said:

SWC Ag said:

LDA9336 said:

titan said:


Can agree with that. Its not even close to why don't think it was shot down.
Would you lay it out for me? How would you debunk or at least respond to the idea that it was?

Its always refreshing to hear from someone who can articulate their thoughts on the matter without standing on the graves of the victims
Or pissing on them.

"Anyone who does not agree with me is disrespecting the victims and the only way to respect the victims is to agree with me"

ok buddy.

When you're ready to discuss like adults, I'll be here.
Do I want to discuss with a truther a conspiracy theory that's been proven false time and time again like an "adult"? That's rich. No, I take the Hitchens route with you and your foolish ilk.

Furthermore, don't try to pin your mocking of the victims (which you've done openly on this thread) on me.
$240 Worth of Pudding
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thirdcoast said:

I remember the GWB days well enough to know Trump was treated worse. I was late HS and college age back then.

I acknowledge Bush was treated bad, Im just saying that Trump was treated much worse. TDS is another animal. Also, the level of SJW wokeness and cancel culture is worse today then back then.

Do you disagree?
Do I disagree that SJW's and wokeness, etc. are worse today? Absolutely not. That's clearly true and as I alluded to before, almost assuredly the fault of social media.

However, you're once again conflating the argument. Just because the media is "worse" now doesn't mean that they weren't terrible when Bush was in office. They were. He was shown contempt, disparaged, and mocked at every turn. If there was anything the media could have done to impugn him, they would have done it. Some on the left were calling for him to be jailed as a war criminal. It's absolutely ridiculous. Every bit as ridiculous as the charges against Trump.
titan
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fka ftc said:

There are several examples of passenger airlines being shot down by missiles / fighter jets. Not one of them resemble anything like Shanksville. Whereas other crash sites of near vertical impacts at high speed look exactly like the impact crater.

The closest fighter jets were unarmed that morning. Pilots have stated they were willing to crash their jets into the airliner if necessary.

The government lies to us, but I just do not see it in this instance.
That's true. In fact, the fighter the witness saw may be one of the ones that was able to breathe a sigh of relief because they didn't have to crash their plane into the jetliner. (Because apparently that was what they were going to do.)
Spyderman
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https://off-guardian.org/2021/09/12/9-11-truth-is-not-a-matter-of-perspective/
Grab some popcorn...why the ongoing cover-up? The Phenomenon: FF to 1:22:35 https://tubitv.com/movies/632920/the-phenomenon

An est. 68 MILLION Americans, including 19 MILLION Black Children, have been killed in the WOMB since 1973-act, pray and vote accordingly.

TAMU purpose statement: To develop leaders of character dedicated to serving the greater good. Team entrance song at KYLE FIELD is laced with profanity including THE Nword..
The greater good?
PlaneCrashGuy
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"The media was mean to 43 therefore it was not shot down"

Ridiculous.
“Not gonna lie...its a little disconcerting to have our minister of positivity be PlaneCrashGuy but Im in"
$240 Worth of Pudding
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LDA9336 said:

"The media was mean to 43 therefore it was not shot down"

Ridiculous.
I wonder if you can make it through the entire list of logical fallacies on this thread. You've got a pretty damn good start.
 
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