A Catholic Bishop draws the line, at last.

3,686 Views | 32 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by PabloSerna
FTACo88-FDT24dad
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San Francisco archbishop bars Pelosi from receiving Holy Communion due to abortion support

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/san-francisco-archbishop-pelosi-communion-abortion-support
AggieRain
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Excellent news.
RebAg13
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jrico2727
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Archbishop Cordileone is a true shepherd.
Pray for him. I fear there will be retaliation.
Pray for Nancy Pelosi, that her heart be soften and be converted, that she repents and comes back into communion with her Bishop.
RAB91
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nortex97
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Good for him!
Silian Rail
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The "wrong side of history" is quickly becoming the right side again.
Faithful Ag
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Very glad to see this!! San Fran Archbishop standing up against the scandalizing of the Eucharist and the Faith!

These politicians like Pelosi, Biden, and anyone openly/publicly supporting and enabling abortion should absolutely have their Bishops minister to them in this way. The Catholic Church, and her Shepherds, must always stand for the truth, be clear and unwavering in their teachings, and do so in a loving way. Unfortunately too many of them would rather avoid their obligations on issues like this and not upset the apple cart.

Archbishop Cordileone exhibited courage and leadership in his decision and I hope many more bishops and cardinals will come out and support him with public statements! The world need more of this!!

Very good Bishop Cordileone. Well done!!
FTACo88-FDT24dad
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Some of the bishops have courage:

https://catholicvote.org/here-is-a-list-of-bishops-speaking-out-in-support-of-archbishop-cordileone/
Faithful Ag
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I would love to see our two Aggie Catholic Bishops join this list as well.

Archbishop Cordileone will likely never become a Cardinal after this action (at least under Francis or a Francis-like successor), and the Bishops joining this list may be limiting their future "career" opportunities as well - BUT we need Bishops with the courage to say what needs to be said and defend the Eucharist and our Faith. This is not the time for our Bishops to hide or lay low.
AggieRain
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Any bishop that would put personal ambition above the faith would be a cardinal in name only. I applaud the courage of the SF bishop and wished more shared it...
SoulSlaveAG2005
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FTACo88-FDT24dad said:

Some of the bishops have courage:

https://catholicvote.org/here-is-a-list-of-bishops-speaking-out-in-support-of-archbishop-cordileone/


That's my Bishop!
This message has been approved by Brad, Jerry and Mitch..
FTACo88-FDT24dad
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I know there are many ways to assess the answer to this question, but it really shines a light on "why haven't more "brother bishops" come out in support of Cardileone?"
747Ag
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AggieRain said:

Any bishop that would put personal ambition above the faith would be a cardinal in name only. I applaud the courage of the SF bishop and wished more shared it...
Right. Salus Animarum Suprema Lex. Souls, not promotions.
PabloSerna
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"I don't want to go to the table with a gun on the table first," - Cardinal Wilton Gregory

LINK to National Catholic Reporter article

+++

It seems like different Bishops have different approaches to the same problem - abortion. I think we can all agree that abortion is not the will of God, who formed us in our mother's womb (JER 1:5). Just the same, Jesus said, "Those who are well do not need a physician, but the sick do." (MT 9:12)



Silian Rail
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PabloSerna said:

"I don't want to go to the table with a gun on the table first," - Cardinal Wilton Gregory

LINK to National Catholic Reporter article

+++

It seems like different Bishops have different approaches to the same problem - abortion. I think we can all agree that abortion is not the will of God, who formed us in our mother's womb (JER 1:5). Just the same, Jesus said, "Those who are well do not need a physician, but the sick do." (MT 9:12)




PabloSerna
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Well aware of this pastoral approach - that is what the article is discussing - did you read it?



ETA: Maybe you have seen what Jesus thinks:




jrico2727
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PabloSerna said:

"I don't want to go to the table with a gun on the table first," - Cardinal Wilton Gregory

LINK to National Catholic Reporter article

+++

It seems like different Bishops have different approaches to the same problem - abortion. I think we can all agree that abortion is not the will of God, who formed us in our mother's womb (JER 1:5). Just the same, Jesus said, "Those who are well do not need a physician, but the sick do." (MT 9:12)




First of all the Pastoral thing to do would be to keep her from further damaging her soul by continuing to receive the blessed sacrament in state that could bring further condemnation to her soul, as taught by scripture and the consistent and infallible teaching of the Church.

"I don't want to go to the table with a gun on the table first," - Cardinal Wilton Gregory

Considering the decades, spent trying to reach out to Nancy and company I would hardly call it coming to the table with a gun first, especially considering the past year Archbishop Cordileone has tried to reach out to her personally and she has refused to speak to him, he also led the faithful to fast and offer rosaries for her conversion of heart. Unfortunately she has turned her back on the Church and is extremely unrepentant. I would call the good Archbishop's effort a last attempt to save her soul.

Got to love the doozy from the National Catholic Distorter.

Fr. Benjamin Hawley, a priest at Holy Trinity, mentioned the back-and-forth over abortion and Communion in his Sunday homily, wrapping his sermon around a theme of God's love. Hawley singled out three things he described as "weapons of mass destruction" that are "destroying our civic and church cultures" exclusion, repression and scorn.

"Inhabitants of these latter cultures think they can solve the challenges of immigration at home, radical Islam abroad, abortion, Latin Mass, Communion for political figures, coastal elites, and many others by excluding, repressing and scorning one group to leave their own group standing perhaps as a white evangelical nation, a smaller, purer church, or coastal elites become national,"

So yeah they are keeping it really not political in the DC diocese.
SoulSlaveAG2005
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jrico2727 said:

PabloSerna said:

"I don't want to go to the table with a gun on the table first," - Cardinal Wilton Gregory

LINK to National Catholic Reporter article

+++

It seems like different Bishops have different approaches to the same problem - abortion. I think we can all agree that abortion is not the will of God, who formed us in our mother's womb (JER 1:5). Just the same, Jesus said, "Those who are well do not need a physician, but the sick do." (MT 9:12)




First of all the Pastoral thing to do would be to keep her from further damaging her soul by continuing to receive the blessed sacrament in state that could bring further condemnation to her soul, as taught by scripture and the consistent and infallible teaching of the Church.

"I don't want to go to the table with a gun on the table first," - Cardinal Wilton Gregory

Considering the decades, spent trying to reach out to Nancy and company I would hardly call it coming to the table with a gun first, especially considering the past year Archbishop Cordileone has tried to reach out to her personally and she has refused to speak to him, he also led the faithful to fast and offer rosaries for her conversion of heart. Unfortunately she has turned her back on the Church and is extremely unrepentant. I would call the good Archbishop's effort a last attempt to save her soul.

Got to love the doozy from the National Catholic Distorter.

Fr. Benjamin Hawley, a priest at Holy Trinity, mentioned the back-and-forth over abortion and Communion in his Sunday homily, wrapping his sermon around a theme of God's love. Hawley singled out three things he described as "weapons of mass destruction" that are "destroying our civic and church cultures" exclusion, repression and scorn.

"Inhabitants of these latter cultures think they can solve the challenges of immigration at home, radical Islam abroad, abortion, Latin Mass, Communion for political figures, coastal elites, and many others by excluding, repressing and scorning one group to leave their own group standing perhaps as a white evangelical nation, a smaller, purer church, or coastal elites become national,"

So yeah they are keeping it really not political in the DC diocese.


I was just about to post the same thing. That quote is disgusting and Fr Hawley should take a long look on the mirror and see that he is embodying the very thing he is castigating. That quote is entirely divisive and shows the true ignorance or absolute misunderstanding about where people are coming from.
This message has been approved by Brad, Jerry and Mitch..
PabloSerna
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"Exclusion, repression, and scorn..."

You mean that quote?

747Ag
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Salus Animarum Suprema Lex... The Salvation of Souls is the Supreme Law (Canon 1752)

Archbishop Cordileone attempted, over many years, to address this issue with Pelosi in private, and only went public after this approach failed. The public sins in question are support for abortion (demonstrated voting record and public comments), causing scandal to the faithful, and finally sacrilege. The move on the part of the archbishop is entirely appropriate. Any good parent would attempt to discipline their child, in private, for sinful behavior. Any good parent would also consider the example of the child needing discipline to other siblings/friends/etc... Lastly, any good parent would step in to try and prevent their child from engaging sinful behavior if they saw it. This is not that hard. Archbishop Cordileone acted as a father in attempting to prevent his spiritual daughter from further committing the sin of sacrilege. Ultimately, it's her soul that's at stake. And so the demons howl as a shepherd attempts to correct and safeguard her soul.

Corileone desires Pelosi's salvation. The actions of his critics tell me that the critics don't care about her.

Salus Animarum Suprema Lex
SoulSlaveAG2005
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PabloSerna said:

"Exclusion, repression, and scorn..."

You mean that quote?




That's part of it. His entire quote is a straw man argument that obfuscates intentions and divides the flock along his pre determined biases.

Pot calling the kettle black.

As a convert I have been challenged and convicted to re-orient some of my political beliefs away from the American dichotomy and change. Public figures should
Not be exempt from re orientation as well and should hold a higher standard to ensure scandal is not brought upon the church by utilizing their profile/influence against the moral teaching of the church.

Abortion isn't a gray area in church moral teaching and is very simple.

Immigration reform, Islamic outreach, racial harmony and other items we can have honest differences on how to achieve (what policies are best etc) the optimal outcomes for all involved (salvation of souls and love of fellow man).

The protection of life from conception to natural death is somewhere the church has a very clear teaching on.

This message has been approved by Brad, Jerry and Mitch..
FTACo88-FDT24dad
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PabloSerna said:

"I don't want to go to the table with a gun on the table first," - Cardinal Wilton Gregory

LINK to National Catholic Reporter article

+++

It seems like different Bishops have different approaches to the same problem - abortion. I think we can all agree that abortion is not the will of God, who formed us in our mother's womb (JER 1:5). Just the same, Jesus said, "Those who are well do not need a physician, but the sick do." (MT 9:12)






Nancy put the gun on the table and loaded it and the non-confrontational Bishops like Gregory have allowed her to not only keep it on the table but they have aided and abetted not only her moral terrorism but they have probably aided and abetted the damage done to souls who look to them and so-called "Catholic" politicians as their sign bearers for what the Church "really thinks" (wink wink) about murdering unborn humans and affirming sodomy and other abominations.

https://catholicvote.org/public-scandal/
Zobel
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Quote:

If it were a civil cause the right of reply would be reserved for the opposing party; it is a religious cause, and I the bishop make a claim...Certainly if anything else is decreed, we bishops cannot contentedly suffer it and take no notice; you indeed may come to the church, but will find either no priest there, or one who will resist you.

What will you answer a priest who says to you, The church does not seek your gifts, because you have adorned the heathen temples with gifts. The Altar of Christ rejects your gifts, because you have made an altar for idols, for the voice is yours, the hand is yours, the subscription is yours, the deed is yours. The Lord Jesus refuses and rejects your service, because you have served idols, for He said to you: 'You cannot serve two masters.' Matthew 6:24 The Virgins consecrated to God have no privileges from you, and do the Vestal Virgins claim them? Why do you ask for the priests of God, to whom you have preferred the profane petitions of the heathen? We cannot take up a share of the errors of others.



Quote:

When have you heard, most gracious Emperor, that laymen gave judgment concerning a bishop in a matter of faith? Are we so prostrate through the flattery of some as to be unmindful of the rights of the priesthood, and do I think that I can entrust to others what God has given me? If a bishop is to be taught by a layman, what will follow? Let the layman argue, and the bishop listen, let the bishop learn of the layman. But undoubtedly, whether we go through the series of the holy Scriptures, or the times of old, who is there who can deny that, in a matter of faith -- in a matter I say of faith -- bishops are wont to judge of Christian emperors, not emperors of bishops.
747Ag
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Quote:

Fr. Benjamin Hawley, a priest at Holy Trinity, mentioned the back-and-forth over abortion and Communion in his Sunday homily, wrapping his sermon around a theme of God's love. Hawley singled out three things he described as "weapons of mass destruction" that are "destroying our civic and church cultures" exclusion, repression and scorn.

"Inhabitants of these latter cultures think they can solve the challenges of immigration at home, radical Islam abroad, abortion, Latin Mass, Communion for political figures, coastal elites, and many others by excluding, repressing and scorning one group to leave their own group standing perhaps as a white evangelical nation, a smaller, purer church, or coastal elites become national,"

Dressed-up Whataboutism.
Silian Rail
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PabloSerna said:

Well aware of this pastoral approach - that is what the article is discussing - did you read it?



ETA: Maybe you have seen what Jesus thinks:







Yes it was the same emasculated "can't we all just get along" that progcaths have been spewing for decades. The only sins worthy of punishment and denouncement are racism and homophobia. Abortion and adultery require so limp wristed a "pastoral approach" you aren't even allowed to tell people they're wrong lest you offend them.
nortex97
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LOL, so RCC and the mainline protestants aren't all that different after all.
PabloSerna
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lol... "progcaths"

Did you make that one up yourself?

747Ag
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PabloSerna said:

lol... "progcaths"

Did you make that one up yourself?
progcaths... leftcaths... tradcaths... novus-ordites... traddies... christianists...

labels are fun.
Silian Rail
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PabloSerna said:

lol... "progcaths"

Did you make that one up yourself?




It's accurate, they're progressives first, Catholics second; so long as it fits with their view of social justice, which is a mix of liberation theology, seamless garmenting and moral relativism.
jkag89
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Colorado Bishops Tell Lawmakers Who Backed State's Abortion Law: 'Refrain From Receiving Holy Communion'
By Kevin J. Jones - Catholic News Agency
Quote:

Catholic lawmakers in Colorado who voted for an extreme abortion bill that stripped all rights from the unborn child should refrain from receiving Holy Communion, the state's four Catholic bishops have said in a letter.

Voting for the Reproductive Health and Equity Act (RHEA) was "participating in a gravely sinful action because it facilitates the killing of innocent unborn babies," said a letter to lawmakers from the state's Catholic bishops.

Catholic politicians who have voted for the legislation "have very likely placed themselves outside of the communion of the Church," said the letter, signed by Archbishop Samuel J. Aquila of Denver, Bishop Stephen J. Berg of Pueblo, Bishop James Golka of Colorado Springs, and Auxiliary Bishop Jorge H. Rodriguez.

The full text of the letter is available here.

The bill treats pre-born babies as "worth less than those who have the gift of being born," the bishops said.

The law explicitly excludes any rights to unborn children, saying "(a) fertilized egg, embryo, or fetus does not have independent or derivative rights under the laws of the state."

It allows abortion up until birth for any reason. Any pregnant individuals have "a fundamental right to continue the pregnancy and give birth or to have an abortion."

The bishops' letter said they tried to speak with lawmakers who voted for the abortion bill to ensure that they understand Catholic teaching. Few lawmakers accepted an invitation to meet.

Silian Rail
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We are going to win. Christus Vincit!
PabloSerna
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Silian Rail said:

PabloSerna said:

lol... "progcaths"

Did you make that one up yourself?




It's accurate, they're progressives first, Catholics second; so long as it fits with their view of social justice, which is a mix of liberation theology, seamless garmenting and moral relativism.
Naa... proportionalism moral theology.. that's the rabbit hole you want to hunt.

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