Why was Jesus baptized?

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chuckd
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8:17a, 4/8/21
AG
Mark 1:4 John appeared, baptizing in the wilderness and proclaiming a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins.

If Jesus was sinless, why was he baptized?

Matt. 3:14-15 John would have prevented him, saying, "I need to be baptized by you, and do you come to me?" But Jesus answered him, "Let it be so now, for thus it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness." Then he consented.

Rom. 8:3 For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh, 4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

2 Cor. 5:21 For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

"if Jesus bore sin vicariously, and received forgiveness vicariously, then there can be no objection on principle to saying that He repented for the people vicariously." Geerhardus Vos, Biblical Theology
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Zobel
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In reply to chuckd • 9:19a, 4/8/21
AG
I think it is important that the Lord did not say - it is just for me to be baptized - but - it is fitting. It is fitting for the Lord to be baptized by His servant to fulfill righteousness. St John the Forerunner says you should baptize me, but instead the roles are reversed. I think viewing baptism linked with death, we could understand this as a revealing of the Lord dying a death He was undeserving of. St John Chrysostom says that He sets the example in humility and again what is a proper understanding of relationship - "It is for Me, being the Master," says He, "proper to make payment for the needy."

And we can also understand that Christ is The Man, the New Adam. He represents all humanity as THE human being who was obedient and faithful as we all should be. Therefore His obedience is what all humans should do. St John Chrysostom also says "And what righteousness is there, someone will say, in being baptized? Obedience for a prophet was righteous. As Christ was circumcised, offered sacrifice, kept the sabbath and observed the Jewish feasts, so also He added this remaining thing, that He was obedient to having been baptized by a prophet. It was the will of God, then, that all should be baptized - about which John speaks: "He having sent me to baptize with water" (John 1:33); so also Christ: "The publicans and the people do justify God, having been baptized with the baptism of John; the Pharisees and the lawyers reject the counsel of God concerning themselves, not having been baptized by him" (Luke 7:29-30). Thus, if obedience to God constitutes righteousness, and God sent John to baptize the nation, then Christ has also fulfilled this along with all the other commandments."


Even further, the fathers say that by becoming human He united Himself to our nature. St Cyril says He "became human for us so that in Him...the grace of the Spirit might be rooted and preserved firmly in our whole nature." Similarly St Athanasius said the "the Spirit's descent on Him in the Jordan was a descent upon us, because of His bearing our body. And it did not take place for promotion to the Word, but again for our sanctification, that we might share His anointing, and of us it might be said, 'Know you not that you are God's Temple, and the Spirit of God dwells in you?' For when the Lord, as Man, was washed in the Jordan, it was we who were washed in Him and by Him. And when He received the Spirit, we it was who by Him were made recipients of It."

He is also understood as representing Israel. The baptism in the Jordan is the new entry of Israel, a reformation of the nation. And by joining to the green shoot that grows out of the root, we are grafted into Israel and become heirs through the Heir.

Another thing the fathers write about is that He had no need of baptism but the waters had need of Him. The coming of the kingdom not only purifies humans but also the world, matter, restoring it to what it should be. Water is supposed to refresh, cleanse, heal us, and this claimed the waters. This is why on the celebration of His baptism in the feast of Theophany we bless the water for its intended purpose (this understanding extends to what blessings are in general).
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codker92
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In reply to chuckd • 9:25a, 4/8/21
AG
Baptism doesn't stop moral sins, just as circumcision does not stop moral sins. Baptism did remove ritual or spiritual uncleanness. The difference really comes from the fact that some sins are moral and others are merely ritual. For example, giving birth in the bible made a woman unclean because the loss of blood in birth was associated with demonic activity. Jesus could be harried by evil spirits in that He was tested by the Enemy in the wilderness, and He defeated the Enemy by His Own Power.


(1) Circumcision and baptism are equated in Colossians 2:9-12.

(2) In addition, it served as a sign for God's people. The burial underwater and subsequent rising served as a typology or a form of prophetic act to foreshadow Jesus death, preaching to the spirits in prison, and subsequent resurrection from the dead.

(3) The baptism served as a seal indicating God's favor upon Jesus.
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dermdoc
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12:16p, 4/8/21
AG
I believe Jesus was baptized to show His humanity.

And why he frequently referred to himself as the Son of Man. Even when betrayed by Judas.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
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94chem
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3:18p, 4/8/21
We could use a few words from Win at Life here to fill us in on the OT traditions.

I will say that Jesus' baptism signified his agreement with John's message - "Repent, for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand." Baptism was a way of saying "amen, brother."

He was entering the priestly service at age 30, symbolically passing through the laver, but unlike the Levitic priests, he did not become unclean upon exiting. He only needed one baptism.

He was assuming the mantle of Elijah, and making it known to John and the disciples that a greater one had arrived.
94chem,
That, sir, was the greatest post in the history of TexAgs. I salute you. -- Dough
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chuckd
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In reply to Zobel • 9:07a, 4/9/21
AG
Good post. Vos similarly writes about the duty given to Israel in John 1:33:
[To fulfill all righteousness] should be taken in a less technical, popular sense; 'righteousness' is that which at any time, through the law or otherwise, is from Jehovah asked of Israel; in the present case this consisted in submission to the baptism of John, for this was not a matter of individual choice, but a national duty; both on Jesus and John ('us') this piece of righteousness has been imposed, and Jesus declares it a matter of duty to observe it;

I especially liked the analogy of the Spirit's descent by St Cyril and Athanasius. Vos:
Jesus did not, of course, receive the Spirit as the agent of sanctification, for that would presuppose sinfulness, nor is there anywhere a trace of such function in the Gospels. But He could and did receive the Spirit as a pledge of the Father's approval of His mind and purpose expressed in submitting to the baptism, and of the effect God would give to it, when accomplished. In this there is an analogy to what the sealing with the Spirit means in baptism to every Christian; only in Jesus' case it was prospective.
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FTACo88-FDT24dad
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7:29a, 4/13/21
AG
Jesus did not receive the same baptism subsequent Christians would receive. The Trinity was there as he went down in the water but he was not baptised with the Trinitarian formula. He went down into the water to sanctify the waters and model for us what we should do after him.
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Martin Q. Blank
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In reply to FTACo88-FDT24dad • 7:36a, 4/13/21
XUSCR said:
Jesus did not receive the same baptism subsequent Christians would receive. The Trinity was there as he went down in the water but he was not baptised with the Trinitarian formula. He went down into the water to sanctify the waters and model for us what we should do after him.
How could it be a model if it's not the same baptism?
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FTACo88-FDT24dad
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In reply to Martin Q. Blank • 3:30p, 4/13/21
AG
Martin Q. Blank said:
XUSCR said:
Jesus did not receive the same baptism subsequent Christians would receive. The Trinity was there as he went down in the water but he was not baptised with the Trinitarian formula. He went down into the water to sanctify the waters and model for us what we should do after him.
How could it be a model if it's not the same baptism?


Perhaps I should rephrase my statement about it not being the same baptism to reflect the fact that it was Trinitarian since all three persons of the Trinity were present and involved but It's not identical because the object of the baptism was not baptized in the specific words of the Trinitarian formula that subsequently became the rule for baptism. So, it's a model in that it shows all non Incarnated Trinitarians how baptism should be effectuated, including the use of the Trinitarian formula if you happen to not be one of the Incarnated persons of the Trinity?
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Husler 00
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3:38p, 4/13/21
AG
There is significance in the fact that Jesus was baptized in the Jordan and it's why John was baptizing his followers there. It was meant to be a renewal of the Israelites entering the promised land. Jesus' baptism in the Jordan is a mirror of Joshua leading the tribes across the Jordan and into the promised land. It's meant to present Jesus as the new Joshua.
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FTACo88-FDT24dad
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2:47p, 4/18/21
AG
Thinking about this some more, there is a link between the baptism of Christ and the crucifixion of Christ.

From Pope Benedict XVI -

Quote:
Looking at the events in the light of the Cross and the Resurrection, the Christian people realized what happened: Jesus loaded the burden of all mankind's guilt upon his shoulders; he bore it down into the depth of the Jordan. He inaugurated his public activity into the place of sinners. His inaugural gesture is in anticipation of the Cross ...

The Baptism is an acceptance of death for the sins of humanity, and the voice that calls out "This is my beloved son" over the baptismal water is an anticipatory reference to the Resurrection.

This explains why, in his own discourses, Jesus uses the word "baptism" to refer to his death (cf Mark 10: 38, Luke 12:50)

Pope Benedict in "Jesus of Nazareth"
This answers the question of why Jesus had to be baptized. The reason Jesus has to be baptized even though he is without sin is the same reason he has to go to the cross even though he is without sin. Baptism is the ultimate anticipation of his Passion as the suffering servant, the sacrifice of atonement that was necessary for us to be saved. It all began with baptism for Jesus and so it must begin with baptism for those of us who wish to be united to his mystical body. God the Father is "well pleased" with Jesus because he is accepting the plan of salvation and baptism in the Jordan is the first step in that plan that ultimately leads to the cross and Resurrection, by which we are saved. He's taking pleasure in Jesus's willingness to do the Father's will even though it means dying on the cross.

Jesus is already saying "yes" to the death that he knows awaits him on the cross when he tells John to go ahead and baptize him to fulfill all righteousness. This has massive implications for all baptized Christians as St. Paul tells us in Romans 6:3-4, 6-7 - "Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? We were therefore buried with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life ... We know that our old self was crucified with him so that the sinful body might be destroyed, and we might no longer be enslaved to sin. For he who has died is freed from sin." ("freed" here can be translated as "justified". The Greek word translated "freed" is dedikaiotai, which means "justified." So the text can literally be translated, "justified from sin." Modern translations render it as "freed from sin" because the context is clearly about sanctification.).

If we want to share in the Resurrection, we have to share in the crucifixion and to do that we have to first share in his baptism and be buried with him "into death" that we might rise again like he did so that we might be freed/justified from our sins.

That's why Jesus had to be baptized: to make it possible for those who would later be baptized to be able to be freed/justified from sin and resurrected from the dead.

I suppose if you don't think sacramental baptism is a real thing, then this explanation won't be satisfactory, but if you do believe in sacramental baptism, I think this is how we must think of the purpose of Jesus's baptism. When we are baptized sacramentally, we are united with the Passion and death of Jesus, and thereby give meaning to our own suffering and death, allowing us to share in not only his suffering and death, but also in his Resurrection. No cross = no Resurrection.
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nortex97
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8:45a, 4/19/21
AG
There is a theory that this is when he became fully God and fully human. As soon as he was baptized, he was recognized as the messiah (in John), and I think that's a pretty big part of the story.

Quote:
For this God has exalted him, favored his name over all names, so at the name of Jesus all knees shall bend, above the earth, upon the earth, and below the earth, and every tongue shall acknowledge that Jesus is the Lord Messiah, to the glory of God the Father. That hymn's two equal parts, each of three verses, reflect the double creedal report of Paul as what he received from tradition (1 Corinthians 15.3-4):

That Messiah died for our sins, in accord with the Sacred Writings; and that he was buried; and that he arose on the third day, in accord with the Sacred Writings It is not surprising, then, that Mark arranges his entire Gospel to emphasize that Jesus is in fact the Messiah and has divine powers. We have already seen Jesus putting bounds on the sea, like God in Genesis. The Gospel opens with a Messianic scene, of John the Baptist as the herald of the Messiah (1.2-11).

John himself says, "A stronger one is coming after me, the thong of whose sandal I am not able to untie" (1.7). As soon as Jesus is baptized, he is identified as Messiah: "And 32 just as he was coming up from the water he saw the heavens being torn up and the Spirit coming down on him as it were a dove" (1.10).

The dove coming over the water recalls the Spirit hovering above the waters at the creation (Genesis 1.2). Jesus as Messiah is inaugurating a new order of creation.

The tearing up of the heavens is an eschatological sign, as at Isaiah 64.1: "Why didst thou not rend the heavens and come down?" When the divine voice from heaven says, "You are my son, my loved one, in whom I delight," this echoes Psalm 2.7,

"You are my son," and Isaiah 42.1, "my chosen one, in whom I delight." Unlike Matthew, Mark does not normally make his references to the Jewish Scripture explicithe assumes that his hearers know what he is referring to.
From garry wills' book. "What the Gospels Meant"
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Zobel
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In reply to nortex97 • 8:47a, 4/19/21
AG
Here the word theory should probably have an asterisk to note that it is rejected as heresy in traditional Christianity.
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ramblin_ag02
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In reply to Zobel • 9:02a, 4/19/21
AG
Zobel said:
Here the word theory should probably have an asterisk to note that it is rejected as heresy in traditional Christianity.
Considering the Catholics, Orthodox, Assyrians, Oriental Orthodox, and all mainline Protestant denominations follow the Nicene Creed, I think we can drop the "traditional" modifier when talking about some heresies.

The heresy espoused is Adoptionism, and it is heretical for a very good reason. If God can take one normal man and "adopt" him into becoming semi-divine, then why couldn't God do it again? Especially with a popular emperor or his chosen vicar? We'd be swimming in "adopted" demigods before we knew it, all claiming equal status with Christ.

As an aside, there is no way in any monotheistic religion for someone to "become fully God". God is eternal and unchanging in all monotheistic religions. It is a fundamental theological principle. For that reason, someone can only become greater than man but lesser than God.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
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nortex97
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In reply to ramblin_ag02 • 10:00a, 4/19/21
AG
It's not adoptionism, it's right there in the gospel of Mark/Luke. I don't think the doctrine of Christ as fully God and fully man, is really a heresy, but I dunno where you guys go to church.

I do think it should be noted that the baptism is the first event where Christ had followers, and was per my excerpt above where the spirit descended on him (again, maybe some gospels are heresies in your church, I dunno, whatever). Brown and most biblical scholars I've read agree it is a genuine part of the bible.

I am not one to debate whether/how God could 'adopt' others and it's not my decision but I do put my faith in the truth of the scriptures and believe if he chose to do so, he'd pretty darn well figure it out. Low christology vs. high is an ancient debate, and I just don't think baby Jesus in the crib (insert scene from Talladega Nights) was all knowing yet, but am fine with those who disagree.
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Zobel
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In reply to nortex97 • 10:05a, 4/19/21
AG
The belief that Jesus became fully God and fully human is textbook adoptionism and is a heresy in every mainline Christian sect.

The Word that was God became man - the man Jesus did not become God.
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ramblin_ag02
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In reply to nortex97 • 10:10a, 4/19/21
AG
nortex97 said:
It's not adoptionism, it's right there in the gospel of Mark/Luke. I don't think the doctrine of Christ as fully God and fully man, is really a heresy, but I dunno where you guys go to church.

I do think it should be noted that the baptism is the first event where Christ had followers, and was per my excerpt above where the spirit descended on him (again, maybe some gospels are heresies in your church, I dunno, whatever). Brown and most biblical scholars I've read agree it is a genuine part of the bible.

I am not one to debate whether/how God could 'adopt' others and it's not my decision but I do put my faith in the truth of the scriptures and believe if he chose to do so, he'd pretty darn well figure it out. Low christology vs. high is an ancient debate, and I just don't think baby Jesus in the crib (insert scene from Talladega Nights) was all knowing yet, but am fine with those who disagree.
Christ has always been fully God and he became fully man as well when he was Incarnated. That's basic Christianity. The idea that he wasn't fully man or wasn't fully God until his baptism is the heresy. There is an ancient heresy called Adoptionism that states that Jesus was a normal man until his baptism. At that point, God called him His Son, thereby adopting Jesus at that moment into divinity. So by this thinking Jesus wasn't the Son of God until his baptism. That's the heretical part. Christianity believes that Jesus is the eternal Son of God that became fully human as well, not some regular human that was made divine at a discreet moment.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
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nortex97
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In reply to ramblin_ag02 • 11:36a, 4/19/21
AG
Normal? I never stated that. There was significance though to the baptism as per what is in the gospels. If you want to ignore that, that's ok, I just take issue with being labeled a heretic just because I think so, since it's the topic of the OP/thread. But really, whatever, it's an internet message board, I don't expect agreement, especially on something like christology.

I have no idea how or frankly why God did it, but I respect that he did as it is told.

I also can't give a thesis/dissertation on the trinity, but I respect that it is real as well. Have a good one guys.
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ramblin_ag02
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In reply to nortex97 • 11:52a, 4/19/21
AG
nortex97 said:
Normal? I never stated that. There was significance though to the baptism as per what is in the gospels. If you want to ignore that, that's ok, I just take issue with being labeled a heretic just because I think so, since it's the topic of the OP/thread. But really, whatever, it's an internet message board, I don't expect agreement, especially on something like christology.

I have no idea how or frankly why God did it, but I respect that he did as it is told.

I also can't give a thesis/dissertation on the trinity, but I respect that it is real as well. Have a good one guys.
That's great and I'm honestly not trying to attack you. One of the problems with Protestants, specifically evangelicals, is that many just don't know any of the history of the Christian Church and try to go soley from the Bible. So they espouse some things that make sense on first blush with this being one of those things. I just wanted to point out that this was a popular heresy in the ancient world, and the Christian church spent a lot of time and effort stomping it out. The first council of Nicea, which is followed by all modern Christians, specifically states that Christians don't believe in this idea.

So my response was less "burn the heretic", and more "hey guy, that's a heresy that was settled long ago. You may want to take another look at your sources and reevaluate"
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
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Bryanisbest
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3:24p, 4/22/21
AG
Baptism symbolizes much more than forgiveness of sins. More importantly, it symbolizes the believer's death and resurrection WITH Christ. Rom 6:3-5. Jesus wanted to lead us in that symbolism that He would later make a reality at Calvary. We become dead to the old self and receive life in the new (new creation, new humanity).
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