And what brought you (or back to) faith?
I've started and deleted multiple responses to this.Martin Q. Blank said:
Heb 6:4 For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.
So would you say the odds are better that you've misinterpreted the scripture or that Jesus/God will deny the salvation of those who turn back towards him?Martin Q. Blank said:
Maybe some atheists on this board were born in China or North Korea, but I'd say most were "once enlightened." In which case it is impossible to restore them again to repentance, or "back to faith" in your words. So to answer your question "How many former atheists/agnostics on this board?" I'd say zero.
Thanks. I'll be sure to pass on your note to our Bishop of Force Conversions.NotAGiantBagOfWater said:
A former atheist doesn't have to belong to your particular faith martin.
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Maybe some atheists on this board were born in China or North Korea, but I'd say most were "once enlightened."
What does Jesus denying salvation mean?SWC Ag said:So would you say the odds are better that you've misinterpreted the scripture or that Jesus/God will deny the salvation of those who turn back towards him?Martin Q. Blank said:
Maybe some atheists on this board were born in China or North Korea, but I'd say most were "once enlightened." In which case it is impossible to restore them again to repentance, or "back to faith" in your words. So to answer your question "How many former atheists/agnostics on this board?" I'd say zero.
I immediately thought of the parable of the prodigal son. The son walked away from the family, but the father welcomed him back with open arms and a grand feast. I'll take that interpretation.SWC Ag said:So would you say the odds are better that you've misinterpreted the scripture or that Jesus/God will deny the salvation of those who turn back towards him?Martin Q. Blank said:
Maybe some atheists on this board were born in China or North Korea, but I'd say most were "once enlightened." In which case it is impossible to restore them again to repentance, or "back to faith" in your words. So to answer your question "How many former atheists/agnostics on this board?" I'd say zero.
diehard03 said:
Rather than having this be some strange thread....to ramblin_ag, Zobel, etc...what's your interpretation of Heb 6:4 and it's application here?
There are a lot of different ways to see the issue with "competing" Bible verses, and all of this played out in Church history without satisfying reconciliation. On the one hand you have verses like this one in Heb 6 and the one in 1 John Chapter 2 coupled with the Novatianists and the Donatists that all think to some degree that apostasy is unforgivable or maybe only forgivable after severe and strenuous pennance.diehard03 said:
Rather than having this be some strange thread....to ramblin_ag, Zobel, etc...what's your interpretation of Heb 6:4 and it's application here?
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Renew them, he says, unto repentance, that is, by repentance, for unto repentance is by repentance. What then, is repentance excluded? Not repentance, far from it! But the renewing again by the laver [i.e., baptism]. For he did not say, impossible to be renewed unto repentance, and stop, but added how impossible, crucifying afresh.
To be renewed, that is, to be made new, for to make men new is of the laver only: for (it is said) your youth shall be renewed as the eagle's. But it is of repentance, when those who have been made new, have afterwards become old through sins, to set them free from this old age, and to make them strong. To bring them to that former brightness however, is not possible; for there the whole was Grace.
He then that baptizes a second time, crucifies Him again.
But what is crucifying afresh? Crucifying over again. For as Christ died on the cross, so do we in baptism, not as to the flesh, but as to sin. Behold two deaths. He died as to the flesh; in our case the old man was buried, and the new man arose, made conformable to the likeness of His death. If therefore it is necessary to be baptized [again], it is necessary that this same [Christ] should die again. For baptism is nothing else than the putting to death of the baptized, and his rising again.
And he well said, crucifying afresh unto themselves. For he that does this, as having forgotten the former grace, and ordering his own life carelessly, acts in all respects as if there were another baptism. It behooves us therefore to take heed and to make ourselves safe.
Martin Q. Blank said:
Maybe some atheists on this board were born in China or North Korea, but I'd say most were "once enlightened." In which case it is impossible to restore them again to repentance, or "back to faith" in your words. So to answer your question "How many former atheists/agnostics on this board?" I'd say zero.
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Reading through it over and over it sure reads like a warning against apostasy to this particular group of believers.
craigernaught said:
Maybe Hebrew 6:4 is just wrong.
https://texags.com/forums/15/topics/3175288/replies/58490349SWC Ag said:
Waiting for Martin Q. Blank to chime back in since he's the one that lit this fuse in the first place.
Really want to hear his interpretation as well as the point he was attempting to make by posting that in response to my question.