Church shooting in East Texas

7,203 Views | 196 Replies | Last: 3 yr ago by Star Wars Memes Only
swimmerbabe11
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(Stephen didn't throw rocks back)

Quote:


I love the truth, and I often get overzealous. Sorry also for allowing this thread to become about me. I was hoping for a security team discussion on this thread on how to keep the flock of God safe. Sometimes I just can't help myself from getting sucked in.

This would be an interesting discussion thread with a caveat on the OP on keeping it practical.. like more of "what does your church do" and less "is it okay to have guns in church" discussion.
TxAgPreacher
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S
swimmerbabe11 said:

(Stephen didn't throw rocks back)

Quote:


I love the truth, and I often get overzealous. Sorry also for allowing this thread to become about me. I was hoping for a security team discussion on this thread on how to keep the flock of God safe. Sometimes I just can't help myself from getting sucked in.

This would be an interesting discussion thread with a caveat on the OP on keeping it practical.. like more of "what does your church do" and less "is it okay to have guns in church" discussion.


Please do. I'll just lurk
Aggrad08
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PacifistAg said:

diehard03 said:

Yep, sounds like baptist to me.
I will say that in my experience spanning multiple denominations, Baptists are the only ones I've known who speak with such certainty about ancient apocalyptic literature from one culture, and read through the lens of a completely different modern culture.


This is rampant throughout evangelical sects. I think it's a dunning Kruger issue for many to be honest. The Bible may as well have been written in English yesterday as far as most are concerned.
Dumpster Fire
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Reposting to new OP
Frok
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AG
Aggrad08 said:

PacifistAg said:

diehard03 said:

Yep, sounds like baptist to me.
I will say that in my experience spanning multiple denominations, Baptists are the only ones I've known who speak with such certainty about ancient apocalyptic literature from one culture, and read through the lens of a completely different modern culture.


This is rampant throughout evangelical sects. I think it's a dunning Kruger issue for many to be honest. The Bible may as well have been written in English yesterday as far as most are concerned.


Man the guy posts that he isn't a baptist but this board still piles on my people anyway.

ramblin_ag02
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Quote:

Man the guy posts that he isn't a baptist but this board still piles on my people anyway.
Despite the many objections I have to the flavor of Christianity of my childhood, it's a verifiable fact that American evangelicals are the most charitable people in the entire world. So yall must be doing something right
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TxAgPreacher
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Frok said:

Aggrad08 said:

PacifistAg said:

diehard03 said:

Yep, sounds like baptist to me.
I will say that in my experience spanning multiple denominations, Baptists are the only ones I've known who speak with such certainty about ancient apocalyptic literature from one culture, and read through the lens of a completely different modern culture.


This is rampant throughout evangelical sects. I think it's a dunning Kruger issue for many to be honest. The Bible may as well have been written in English yesterday as far as most are concerned.


Man the guy posts that he isn't a baptist but this board still piles on my people anyway.




I hope to see your people in heaven!
TxAgPreacher
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S
Does anyone have a good church security plan?
Frok
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TxAgPreacher said:

Frok said:

Aggrad08 said:

PacifistAg said:

diehard03 said:

Yep, sounds like baptist to me.
I will say that in my experience spanning multiple denominations, Baptists are the only ones I've known who speak with such certainty about ancient apocalyptic literature from one culture, and read through the lens of a completely different modern culture.


This is rampant throughout evangelical sects. I think it's a dunning Kruger issue for many to be honest. The Bible may as well have been written in English yesterday as far as most are concerned.


Man the guy posts that he isn't a baptist but this board still piles on my people anyway.




I hope to see your people in heaven!


Edit:
Was supposed to be a thumbs up
Frok
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TxAgPreacher said:

Does anyone have a good church security plan?


My church has a security team but that's because we have an ex White House security guy that attends our church(Super Serious guy, haha). He has cameras and a team that watches for any unusual activity and then if we have a concern we do have two police offices we pay to attend each service.
Zobel
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Can you re-post this to a new OP, please?
Dumpster Fire
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sure.
TxAgPreacher
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Frok said:

TxAgPreacher said:

Does anyone have a good church security plan?


My church has a security team but that's because we have an ex White House security guy that attends our church(Super Serious guy, haha). He has cameras and a team that watches for any unusual activity and then if we have a concern we do have two police offices we pay to attend each service.
We have a ex military man who watches people, but we are disorganized. Do y'all lock the doors during services?
diehard03
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Quote:

Do y'all lock the doors during services?

You'd have to have someone stationed at the door then to let stragglers in?
AsburyAg
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We do, Preacher. I'd be willing to tell you more about it.

If you want, email me. Jeff at laneschapel dot com.
TxAgPreacher
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diehard03 said:

Quote:

Do y'all lock the doors during services?

You'd have to have someone stationed at the door then to let stragglers in?
Yes. Just so that you'd have eyes on anyone coming in.
Kevin83
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Very sad, where has our country gone .
Aggrad08
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one MEEN Ag said:

Everyone here who is against guns in the house or keeping them for self defense lives in a bubble created by their wealth. Where all the impoliteness, desperateness, and violent tendencies of man are kept away. And while it's okay to live in a bubble, understand that bubbles get popped all the time. I've never understood not having any protection-period.

Do I think I'm going to get run up by a gang? No. But I also know that I can be a target anytime and I owe it to my family to protect them.


I empathize with this view. I have guns but never carry. And never in my life have I needed a gun and it's my good fortune. Twice in my life I've put myself at physical risk to stop harm coming to someone. Once at a bar in houston and once to break up a domestic in the neighboring hotel room (at a very nice hotel which is probably not what you just pictured)

I did not want or need a gun in either situation, but I'm still young enough to be strong. Women and the elderly have no security in their person the way men do.

Further once I started training Jui jitsu years ago I got to where I could comfortably incapacitate most people who are not dramatically bigger. I don't even want to hit anyone doing harm anymore I'd rather incapacitate as harmlessly as possible.

My wife on the other hand has been a victim of sexual assault. And carries pepper spray at all times. And feels much more comfortable with a knife in her pocket or purse. She's got no instinct to harm anyone, this isn't a redneck almost if not outright hoping for an opportunity, she's been bitten and knows she's to small to fend off most men.

Dogs scare me less, I've found an extremely aggressive reaction works well. We are a joke to bears or a moose and I always want something in the woods.

I don't mind people being armed I'm generally pro second amendment. But honestly I'm LESS likely to render aid when armed. When armed I'm not going to try and restrain someone, what If they felt the gun and reached for it, I just made a possibly non lethal situation lethal. Same with a knife.

And I think for active mass shooters (terribly rare) we should teach people to bum rush attackers not shoot unless you have a very clear shot.

I respect shepherd minded people. But I've got nothing but respect for the pacifists, I think it's a failed strategy if too many people do it to resist bad actors broadly, but I don't see that happening. And I think we'd benefit from a larger portion of our population thinking this way than the small percentage that does currently.
one MEEN Ag
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PacifistAg said:


Quote:

Everyone here who is against guns in the house or keeping them for self defense lives in a bubble created by their wealth. Where all the impoliteness, desperateness, and violent tendencies of man are kept away. And while it's okay to live in a bubble, understand that bubbles get popped all the time. I've never understood not having any protection-period.
False. I've lived in rough areas of Houston. I've gone unarmed, and was even assaulted, in Palestine. Granted, the assault came from an Israeli settler who was mad that we were escorting kindergartners to school. I'm not a pacifist because it's easy. I've faced several instances where violence would be justified to defend myself. I choose not to use those tactics. It has nothing to do with my "wealth".
Your individual wealth - no, because you can chose to spend it on whatever you want. But wealth in general - yes. People with the means to, will move away from violent areas and towards safer ones. That's just human nature. You're throwing out the foundational pieces of why people chose houses in favor of your anecdotal experiences of pacifism. People want safety in their home, and the marketplace puts a premium on that and discounts areas that aren't safe.

PacifistAg
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one MEEN Ag said:

PacifistAg said:


Quote:

Everyone here who is against guns in the house or keeping them for self defense lives in a bubble created by their wealth. Where all the impoliteness, desperateness, and violent tendencies of man are kept away. And while it's okay to live in a bubble, understand that bubbles get popped all the time. I've never understood not having any protection-period.
False. I've lived in rough areas of Houston. I've gone unarmed, and was even assaulted, in Palestine. Granted, the assault came from an Israeli settler who was mad that we were escorting kindergartners to school. I'm not a pacifist because it's easy. I've faced several instances where violence would be justified to defend myself. I choose not to use those tactics. It has nothing to do with my "wealth".
Your individual wealth - no, because you can chose to spend it on whatever you want. But wealth in general - yes. People with the means to, will move away from violent areas and towards safer ones. That's just human nature. You're throwing out the foundational pieces of why people chose houses in favor of your anecdotal experiences of pacifism. People want safety in their home, and the marketplace puts a premium on that and discounts areas that aren't safe.


You are the one who used absolute terms like "everyone". I simply used my anecdotal evidence to refute your absolutist claim. No, not everyone who is "against guns" lives in a bubble created by their wealth. Avoid absolutist terms in arguments. I can give another example if you'd like. Just look at Shane Claiborne. Lives in inner city Philadelphia, and not only refuses the means for violent self-defense, but is active in taking those means and turning them into something useful (guns into garden tools).
one MEEN Ag
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PacifistAg said:

one MEEN Ag said:

PacifistAg said:


Quote:

Everyone here who is against guns in the house or keeping them for self defense lives in a bubble created by their wealth. Where all the impoliteness, desperateness, and violent tendencies of man are kept away. And while it's okay to live in a bubble, understand that bubbles get popped all the time. I've never understood not having any protection-period.
False. I've lived in rough areas of Houston. I've gone unarmed, and was even assaulted, in Palestine. Granted, the assault came from an Israeli settler who was mad that we were escorting kindergartners to school. I'm not a pacifist because it's easy. I've faced several instances where violence would be justified to defend myself. I choose not to use those tactics. It has nothing to do with my "wealth".
Your individual wealth - no, because you can chose to spend it on whatever you want. But wealth in general - yes. People with the means to, will move away from violent areas and towards safer ones. That's just human nature. You're throwing out the foundational pieces of why people chose houses in favor of your anecdotal experiences of pacifism. People want safety in their home, and the marketplace puts a premium on that and discounts areas that aren't safe.


You are the one who used absolute terms like "everyone". I simply used my anecdotal evidence to refute your absolutist claim. No, not everyone who is "against guns" lives in a bubble created by their wealth. Avoid absolutist terms in arguments. I can give another example if you'd like. Just look at Shane Claiborne. Lives in inner city Philadelphia, and not only refuses the means for violent self-defense, but is active in taking those means and turning them into something useful (guns into garden tools).
Fine. 99.999999% of people with the means to move out of a bad situation in a bad neighborhood will do so.

Your counterpoint undermines you. There are so few people who decide to stick around when they could easily move, that this guy is making headlines for not moving away. His story contrasts with what we normally see happen.

Every now and then, you'll see a post on Texags that says, 'Hey what kind of gun should I get? Because X just happened to me in my nice neighborhood and I'm scared/my sense of security is shattered' And the mentality, as I originally pointed out, is at the center of it.


PacifistAg
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It doesn't undermine my point at all. Yes, people like us are the exception. My issue was with your absolutist phrasing. No, not everyone who rejects violence or guns lives in a bubble created by their wealth.

Just don't be so sloppy with your wording.
Star Wars Memes Only
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Aggrad08 said:



I empathize with this view. I have guns but never carry. And never in my life have I needed a gun and it's my good fortune. Twice in my life I've put myself at physical risk to stop harm coming to someone. Once at a bar in houston and once to break up a domestic in the neighboring hotel room (at a very nice hotel which is probably not what you just pictured)

< SNIP >
 
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