Chemistry Nobel goes to CRISPR

1,687 Views | 18 Replies | Last: 3 yr ago by amercer
amercer
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AG
It was more of a question of when, not if, but the fact they left Feng Zheng out will be a bitter topic for years to come.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/07/health/nobel-prize-2020-winner-chemistry-scn-intl/index.html
schmendeler
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AG
i was only semi-aware of how CRISPR worked until i watched a recent NOVA called "Human Nature". i thought it was quite fascinating. people in the field might not share my layperson's view, but i recommend giving it a watch.

it's available to stream on Netflix, now.
UTExan
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Oh great. See how fast this goes from therapy to creation of a dominant strain of Homo sapiens.
It is better to light a flamethrower than to curse the darkness- Sir Terence Pratchett
“ III stooges si viveret et nos omnes ad quos etiam probabile est mittent custard pies”
ramblin_ag02
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UTExan said:

Oh great. See how fast this goes from therapy to creation of a dominant strain of Homo sapiens.
Is my fear as well. You think the have/have-not gap is big now? Wait until the wealthy and connected can guarantee that they will be more attractive, smarter, more athletic, and healthier. It's a real recipe for dystopia. Oddly, CRISPR is cheap and relatively easy to use, but goverment regulation could still restrict access. I'm pretty suspicious of the Chinese researcher that modified those kids to be HIV immune. I bet that's the tip of the iceberg over there, and he's a fall guy/smokescreen for their real program. It's just too powerful to ignore.
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Rocag
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The future is GATTACA.
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Serotonin
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AstroAg17 said:

Off target mutations still make CRISPR hard to use on humans.

Still it's a technology that could one day make our lives a lot better. I hope the scientific community gets better at communicating with the public.


A world of flawed humans with suffering and pain is tragic and almost unbearable.

A world of genetically-modified humans without suffering or pain is much worse.
ramblin_ag02
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It's going to be super tricky. If it is restricted, then you could easily end up with a GATTACA dystopia or even an artificial speciation of humanity. You get the rich and connected with an access that other's don't have and the results could be world-altering.

If it's widely availble, then you're on a eerily similar path to eugenics by editing out all the "detrimental" genes. Would black people be tempted to have white children so their lives would be easier? Would white people be tempted to have black children to get affirmative action perks? What about editing out genes for hostility making everyone more friendly and cooperative? Even in a well-meaning society-wide effort, things could get real weird real fast.

If you try to restrict it to purely genetic diseases, then how do you enforce that? How do you keep people honest and following the rules when so much is at stake? I'd probably do just about anything short of theft or murder if I could guarantee that my kids would be genetically gifted in every way. Certainly a few government regulations wouldn't stop me
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Serotonin
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AG
Well said.
UTExan
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That is likely to happen. I have often wondered about genetic manipulation in that passage in Revelation 9:6 where men "will seek death" and shall not find it. A physical body which can heal itself from injury and disease but a mind and soul which are unredeemed. I cannot think of anything worse.
It is better to light a flamethrower than to curse the darkness- Sir Terence Pratchett
“ III stooges si viveret et nos omnes ad quos etiam probabile est mittent custard pies”
Star Wars Memes Only
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Serotonin said:

AstroAg17 said:

Off target mutations still make CRISPR hard to use on humans.

Still it's a technology that could one day make our lives a lot better. I hope the scientific community gets better at communicating with the public.


A world of flawed humans with suffering and pain is tragic and almost unbearable.

A world of genetically-modified humans without suffering or pain is much worse.

Is your objection primarily morality-based, based on the fear that the technology could affect the body in some unforeseen ways, or something else?

For instance, if there was some sort of gene therapy that would rid me of my migraines, without any substantial risk of changing my personality or causing me cancer or whatnot, I would take it without hesitation. Would you object to this sort of thing?
Serotonin
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AG

Quote:

For instance, if there was some sort of gene therapy that would rid me of my migraines, without any substantial risk of changing my personality or causing me cancer or whatnot, I would take it without hesitation. Would you object to this sort of thing?
Not at all, in fact I would do exactly the same for myself or my children.
Quote:

Is your objection primarily morality-based, based on the fear that the technology could affect the body in some unforeseen ways, or something else?
Good question, for me it's both. I'll come back later with a longer post explaining that, but wanted to make the first answer above clear. We're in agreement there.
TheArtistFormerlyKnownAs
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I'm looking forward to implementing genetic advances
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Serotonin
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AG
AstroAg17 said:

Serotonin said:

AstroAg17 said:

Off target mutations still make CRISPR hard to use on humans.

Still it's a technology that could one day make our lives a lot better. I hope the scientific community gets better at communicating with the public.


A world of flawed humans with suffering and pain is tragic and almost unbearable.

A world of genetically-modified humans without suffering or pain is much worse.
Can you elaborate on this?
I agree with your statement, it will make people's lives better. From a utilitarian perspective it's a clear win...at first. But that's also not the whole the story.

My concern is what happens in the long run.

I know this is decades or centuries away, but do you see a natural stopping point with CRISPR? What is the ultimate aim, if you had to summarize in a sentence or two?
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Star Wars Memes Only
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CRISPRs don't kill people, people kill people.
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schmendeler
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AG
AstroAg17 said:

I always feel weird describing things in biology as "technology". I feel like if you can find it or something similar in nature, technology is the wrong word. Biotech has a nice ring to it but those dudes are sometimes just growing mold in a jar. From the words they use to describe it you'd think they were building the space shuttle.

I know I'm technically wrong on this, and it falls under the formal definition of technology, but I don't think the connotation matches.


Biotool?
amercer
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AG
Discovery and invention are often used interchangeably, but they aren't the same.

The distinction seemed important to the Nobel committee this year as the two ladies who discovered CRISPR got the prize, and the guy who did the most to make it useful (and snag all the patents) was left out.

The technology that makes my TV work is just stuff the universe does anyway, repackaged in a box to make me dumber. Most biotech isn't all that different
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