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Then God spoke all these words I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery.

You shall not have other gods beside me. You shall not make for yourself an idol or a likeness of anything in the heavens above or on the earth below or in the waters beneath the earth; you shall not bow down before them or serve them. For I, the LORD, your God, am a jealous God, inflicting punishment for their ancestors' wickedness on the children of those who hate me, down to the third and fourth generation but showing love down to the thousandth generation of those who love me and keep my commandments.

You shall not invoke the name of the LORD, your God, in vain. For the LORD will not leave unpunished anyone who invokes his name in vain.

Remember the sabbath daykeep it holy. Six days you may labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a sabbath of the LORD your God.f You shall not do any work, either you, your son or your daughter, your male or female slave, your work animal, or the resident alien within your gates. For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them; but on the seventh day he rested.g That is why the LORD has blessed the sabbath day and made it holy.*

Honor your father and your mother, that you may have a long life in the land the LORD your God is giving you.i

You shall not kill..

You shall not commit adultery.

You shall not steal.

You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

You shall not covet your neighbor's house.

You shall not covet your neighbor's wife, his male or female slave, his ox or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor.

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diehard03 said:

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My question is why was the second commandment concerning graven images omitted in the Catholic Bible

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This is such a non-starter as a non-Catholic.

The commandment is against graven images that you actually worship as a God itself.

No Catholic actually worships the icon itself as God.

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k2aggie07 said:

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A reading of this as no statues or physical representations of anything is clearly incorrect, though. The Temple had carvings and statues of plants and animals.

The prohibition here is for a carved image, a pesel; and moreoever any likeness, a temunah. When the Jewish translators of the Septuagint put this into Greek they did not use the word for "image" (icon) but idol - eidolon, and for likeness they used homoioma - that which is made after the likeness of something. So here this makes sense as - don't carve yourself an idol (carve or hew is the root word for pesel) or make one by any other method.

Interestingly while humans are not allowed to make things in the homoiosis of God, He is of course happy to make icons and images of Himself...namely humans (Gen 1:26).

Reading on then the prohibition is against both bowing down and serving these idols (you shall not bow down to them nor serve them). In Greek these words are reverencing (proskynesis) and serving (latreia). And, when you combine eidolon and latreaia you get: idolatry. Serving idols.

The word for bowing down or reverencing is used both for showing respect and full blown worship in the OT, so again context matters. Again, this isn't saying - don't bow down to show reverence to anything but God (because people bow down and reverence each other - which makes sense as icons of God) but don't bow down or show reverence to an idol. And reading even further, we really get the point: because God is jealous. In other words the reason bowing down and serving idols is bad is because it robs what is due to God alone.

Reverencing an icon is paying homage not to the image itself but to the one who is the prototype. Just as when traveling you may kiss a picture of your loved ones -- this love is not for the paper but for the people it represents. And again this is clear why reverencing an idol is bad: because you're not bowing down to the image or carving itself but to what it represents: a god, or a demon, or nothing at all. But at any rate it's certainly not reverence to God.

In a beautiful way, reverencing people contrasts this as a second-order of reverence to the prototype. Reverencing a person, showing respect and honor and love, is truly showing that same homage and love to the prototype of all mankind - God Himself.

And, we should never worship or serve people, or icons, or images. This mode of worship - latreia - to serve something, to bind yourself to service in a divine way (vs menial way like doulos or diakonos - slavery or service or ministering) is due to God alone.

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Martin Q. Blank said:

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k2aggie07 said:

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A reading of this as no statues or physical representations of anything is clearly incorrect, though. The Temple had carvings and statues of plants and animals.

The prohibition here is for a carved image, a pesel; and moreoever any likeness, a temunah. When the Jewish translators of the Septuagint put this into Greek they did not use the word for "image" (icon) but idol - eidolon, and for likeness they used homoioma - that which is made after the likeness of something. So here this makes sense as - don't carve yourself an idol (carve or hew is the root word for pesel) or make one by any other method.

Interestingly while humans are not allowed to make things in the homoiosis of God, He is of course happy to make icons and images of Himself...namely humans (Gen 1:26).

Reading on then the prohibition is against both bowing down and serving these idols (you shall not bow down to them nor serve them). In Greek these words are reverencing (proskynesis) and serving (latreia). And, when you combine eidolon and latreaia you get: idolatry. Serving idols.

The word for bowing down or reverencing is used both for showing respect and full blown worship in the OT, so again context matters. Again, this isn't saying - don't bow down to show reverence to anything but God (because people bow down and reverence each other - which makes sense as icons of God) but don't bow down or show reverence to an idol. And reading even further, we really get the point: because God is jealous. In other words the reason bowing down and serving idols is bad is because it robs what is due to God alone.

Reverencing an icon is paying homage not to the image itself but to the one who is the prototype. Just as when traveling you may kiss a picture of your loved ones -- this love is not for the paper but for the people it represents. And again this is clear why reverencing an idol is bad: because you're not bowing down to the image or carving itself but to what it represents: a god, or a demon, or nothing at all. But at any rate it's certainly not reverence to God.

In a beautiful way, reverencing people contrasts this as a second-order of reverence to the prototype. Reverencing a person, showing respect and honor and love, is truly showing that same homage and love to the prototype of all mankind - God Himself.

And, we should never worship or serve people, or icons, or images. This mode of worship - latreia - to serve something, to bind yourself to service in a divine way (vs menial way like doulos or diakonos - slavery or service or ministering) is due to God alone.

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Calm down bro. I just post a verse.

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Martin Q. Blank said:

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I wasn't trolling, but responding to the comment "The commandment is..." I posted the actual commandment since it is the subject of this thread.

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