PacifistAg said:

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Funny enough, I thought it was a white person who was advocating for a minority/marginalized cause.

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That would actually be a good thing, but they are really big on keeping to your own "kind", so that makes advocating for minority/marginalized causes difficult.

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That is the stupidest thing I've ever read. You know you are lying. Isn't that a sin?

I'm all about causes that actually benefit minority communities in the long-term. Just because I connect with people like me the easiest doesn't mean I wish ill of others. Through God's grace, I am able do a lot to help raise up responsible people of all races and ethnicities. If staff were so inclined, they could actually look that up, seeing as how they know my identity.

You've really gone off the rails, PacifistAg. Your hateful lies are disgusting.

Who said anything about wishing ill upon others? Not off the rails at all. Heck, I've seen those from your ilk argue on the politics forum that race mixing is unbiblical. No lies in anything I said. Just going by what I see y'all say elsewhere.

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WA Criswell -"I have always felt that it was only after a child was born and had life separate from its mother that it became an individual person, and it has always, therefore, seemed to me that what is best for the mother and for the future should be allowed."

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So he made a decision based on feelings? What insight does he have about when life begins? I don't know who he is, is his opinion greater than anyone else?

I don't pretend to know when life begins, therefore I want to be cautious with all potential life and not arbitrarily end it best on my feelings. All life and potential life should be protected and should have as much right to life as you.

WA Criswell is huge in Baptist circles. Was head of SBC for two terms. Was pastor of First Baptist Dallas for nearly 50 years.

Can someone fill me in on what user names Orko & Sullys Guy used in the past.

I believe Orko was Resistol. Not sure who he was before that. Sully, I'm pretty sure, is bustup. Very similar style at least.

BQ78 said:

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WA Criswell -"I have always felt that it was only after a child was born and had life separate from its mother that it became an individual person, and it has always, therefore, seemed to me that what is best for the mother and for the future should be allowed."

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So he made a decision based on feelings? What insight does he have about when life begins? I don't know who he is, is his opinion greater than anyone else?

I don't pretend to know when life begins, therefore I want to be cautious with all potential life and not arbitrarily end it best on my feelings. All life and potential life should be protected and should have as much right to life as you.

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As Pacifist said, these guys are major players and are quite conservative.

They certainly had all the information you have now. So why has the more conservative element of faith become so strongly anti-choice in the last two to three decades?

It is not a liberal christian position that life begins when you breath your first breath. At least historically, that's the case.

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As Pacifist said, these guys are major players and are quite conservative

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I like to think that you were talking about me and my "ilk" when you wrote that. It's all Pacifist talks about lately.

Obviously he is not conservative enough to protect what may be life. And his scientific credentials seem no better than mine and as I said, I'm not sure when life begins so I'm not going to destroy a life or potential life for my convenience.

BQ78 said:

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Obviously he is not conservative enough to protect what may be life. And his scientific credentials seem no better than mine and as I said, I'm not sure when life begins so I'm not going to destroy a life or potential life for my convenience.

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Well, I guess it depends on how one defines "conservative". I disagree with Criswell, but terms like "conservative" and "liberal" seem to have so many varied definitions that it's almost impossible to know what one means when it's used.

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It really wasn't until the late 70's that churches started to take a hard stance on abortion. Why is that?

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The short answer is because the church has often found itself on the wrong side of morality, but by God's grace has been able to reform, and even champion, just causes.

The longer answer is because during the run-up to the Reagan revolution in the early 80's, the Republican party realized that the racially-charged rhetoric of George Wallace, thinly disguised as states' rights, was not palatable, and would be ineffective for unifying the party. Therefore, they unified the party around social conservatism, causing many Democrat evangelicals to move permanently to the Republican party. To this day we see this mix of Buchanan/Trump blue collars, Rand/Wall Street trickle down tycoons, Falwell/evangelical so-cons, Rand Paul isolationists, interventionist neocons, and a sliver of highly educated evangelical so-cons...all unified strangely by Reagan.

Aggie4Life02 said:

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94chem said:

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Sullys Guy said:

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"Baptist Minister"

Nuff said

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I don't understand. What do you mean?

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There is no such thing as a Christian female minister.

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...and this answer made no sense. On many levels.

BQ78 said:

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Obviously he is not conservative enough to protect what may be life. And his scientific credentials seem no better than mine and as I said, I'm not sure when life begins so I'm not going to destroy a life or potential life for my convenience.

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I think by making it a scientific issue, you are missing his point.

jkag89 said:

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So why has the more conservative element of faith become so strongly anti-choice in the last two to three decades?

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Do you consider the Catholic Church a "conservative element" of the faith? While abortion was not a priority issue with United States Conference of Catholic Bishops prior to Roe v Wade its reaction to the decision was immediately against and has remained constant and consistent since and is completely in line with what the Church has always taught, that abortion was a grave moral evil.

The Roman Catholic Church and Abortion: An Historical Perspective - Part I

The Roman Catholic Church and Abortion: An Historical Perspective - Part II

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Fair point. I was referring more to protestants.

His point is quite weak and not conservative at all. He feels it is not a life so that means he is not sure. A conservative would not dive into a murky pool even if he feels the water is deep.