*** BLACK PANTHER: WAKANDA FOREVER *** (Spoilers)

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TCTTS
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With the first showings kicking off as I type this, I figure it's time to get a spoiler thread going. Will be seeing this Friday night myself, so I'll see you guys back here then...
QRI-Ag
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Wakanda Forever is SO GOOD, the girls rock, the music, the emotion, everything is on point. Of course it is probably the best of this phase imo. I didn't care much for Thor:Love and thunder or doctor strange 2.
Madmarttigan
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QRI-Ag said:

Wakanda Forever is SO GOOD, the girls rock, the music, the emotion, everything is on point. Of course it is probably the best of this phase imo. I didn't care much for Thor:Love and thunder of doctor strange 2.


Since I also didnt care much for those 2, I find that encouraging this is a change.
Formerly tv1113
Brian Earl Spilner
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I went into this not particularly hyped, and not the biggest fan of Letitia Wright.

She absolutely killed this role. I didn't necessarily buy her as the actual BP, but she was fantastic in the movie overall.

As a Mexican, I absolutely loved Namor and seeing the Mayan culture depicted onscreen.

I think the movie was probably 20 minutes too long, which is the biggest complaint I've seen. And the final battle was kind of anticlimactic imo. But overall I enjoyed it more than 1, mainly due to Namor.
Ghost of Bisbee
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Brian Earl Spilner said:

I went into this not particularly hyped, and not the biggest fan of Letitia Wright.

She absolutely killed this role. I didn't necessarily buy her as the actual BP, but she was fantastic in the movie overall.

As a Mexican, I absolutely loved Namor and seeing the Mayan culture depicted onscreen.

I think the movie was probably 20 minutes too long, which is the biggest complaint I've seen. And the final battle was kind of anticlimactic imo. But overall I enjoyed it more than 1, mainly due to Namor.


hedge? That you?

This is good to hear. May have to give this a shot. I'll probably wait until Disney plus and go see banshees of inisherin instead
CapCityAg89
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My daughter and I loved this movie. They get you in the feels right from the jump. Killing the Queen and isolating Shuri made her transition to a vengeful Panther more believable for me. Michael B Jordan. Wow. Great.

I was really apprehensive going in but I think everything about this movie was nails. And that extra credit scene … fantastic.
kerrag06
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Very emotional movie in about 4/5 different places. Just when you think the memorialization and tributes were done, out comes more- but done amazingly. . The movie definitely hit home a little harder for me having lost my mom to Colon cancer a few years ago. The fact Chadwick was pushing through and doing his press appearances and trying to be strong makes me respect the man more than anyone in that industry in a long time. Definitely a different type of movie than the last few marvel movies. It had a much more old school (phase 1-3) feel to it- which I loved. 100% recommend the movie.
Ghost of Bisbee
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Did you like it more than Iron Man?
ElephantRider
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Brian Earl Spilner said:

I went into this not particularly hyped, and not the biggest fan of Letitia Wright.

She absolutely killed this role. I didn't necessarily buy her as the actual BP, but she was fantastic in the movie overall.

As a Mexican, I absolutely loved Namor and seeing the Mayan culture depicted onscreen.

I think the movie was probably 20 minutes too long, which is the biggest complaint I've seen. And the final battle was kind of anticlimactic imo. But overall I enjoyed it more than 1, mainly due to Namor.

Maybe I'll feel differently once I see it, but I also don't buy her as Black Panther. I feel like any other choice would have been better.
kerrag06
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I cant completely say I liked it more than Iron Man. But it's without a doubt in my top 5 for marvel movies thus far. It also has a few important twists and unexpected cast members just as some of the more memorable marvel movies have had. Beautiful end credit scene as well. I personally was wanting the new BP to be the sister. For a bit I almost expected it to be his apparent wife/princess (nekeya). I did NOT want it to be any of the Dora Maji or any of the guys still around- although M-Bapu (whatever) is hilarious now. Also didn't see the other tragedy in the movie happening- but that further makes the sister the right choice in my opinion. A person taking up the BP mantle who has lost literally everything imaginable in a span of about 7 years?? Perfect!
Brian Earl Spilner
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I really thought it would be Nakia also, especially when she showed up right at the moment she was able to create the flower.
Juan Solo
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Awesome movie visually!
Enjoyed Namors Mayan background
Ironheart didn't really do much for me..
Final battle felt like I was watching Batman vs Super Man, only thing missing would have been if their moms shared the same name.
Some lone idiot kept clapping throughout Chadwick's moment of silence tribute in the beginning.
They found a way to make him say "Imperius Rex" though out of place

The post cred jerked tears since I'll be a new dad next month :')
kerrag06
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I agree! I kept thinking that final scene was basically Avatar meets Aquaman! The similarities between DC Comic Stories and Marvel stories are beyond striking. While I'm not a comic book historian or very knowledgeable it's hard to miss. Aquaman vs Namor. Flashs ability to change time vs Quantum Realm etc. And in some degree Suicide Squad vs The Upcoming Thunderbolts movie/team. Either way I'm sure I'll be at just about every opening night/weekend movie for the foreseeable future for both movie universes. I genuinely hope DC gets their act together. Having a higher quantity of awesome movies to go to makes it more fun for fans. Even just their previews seem like such a lower quality. Not to mention the way they do their logo introduction to the movie- looks like some kid in HS Tech Class could do that. The Marvel logo lead in for Black Panter in is absolutely remarkable, emotional and sets the movie up better than any type of intro ever could. Hope you guys enjoy the movie! BTHO Auburn... maybe?
Brian Earl Spilner
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I will say the underwater stuff was cool but not quite as spectacular as I was expecting? Probably unfair to compare it to something like Aquaman.

I will say it made me all the more excited for Avatar next month. That is gonna blow everyone away.
amercer
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Just saw it. Noon IMAX showing that was sold out (most people in the DC area are off today, but not kids, so perfect movie afternoon)

Thought it was very good. It was absolutely a memorial. So a little different than any other Marvel movie. They kept sort of re-centering the movie towards grief and loss instead of the usual high-five explosion thing.

Other random note, I think the audience in my showing was about 50% African American. The little mermaid teaser trailer got applause. I think that movie is going to do really well.
Saxsoon
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Letitia made a huge step up basically carrying the film on her shoulders. Was not expecting this to be her film even if I felt like she would become BP.

riri was fun and excited to see her show

Namor, badass

MBJ showing up because of her vengeance was an inspired choice.

I don't know many ways you could have done this without CB but they did an incredible job.

Wasn't expecting Dreyfus but I liked it.
fig96
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Back home after a midafternoon showing…wow.

Leticia Wright absolutely kills it in this film, she's just fantastic in every scene. The only thing that might have been better than her is Tenoch Huerta. I only knew him from Narcos but he just owns the screen in every moment he shows up, huge presence yet totally relatable for what he and his people have been through. He's gonna be a star.

Overall just really enjoyed this. M'Baku is fantastic in his short amount of screen time, Angela Bassett was fantastic and Okoye and the rest of the Dora Milage are their usual badass selfs. The Talokan world and other areas of Wakanda are incredibly designed and the film overall is just beautifully shot.

Easily my favorite Marvel film of this phase and near my top 5, can't wait to see it again.
Aggie_Journalist
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I really hope I'm in the minority on this, but this is as underwhelmed as I've ever been by a Marvel film.

There was some good
- Angela Bassett was nails
- The moments of Shuri dealing with her grief, hurt, and anger were compelling, start to finish
- The surprise cameo from Killmonger was a great "Wow!" Moment and perfectly upped the ante on the conflict within shuri

But most of the movie just didn't click for me at all
- The action was all forgettable
- Everything about the iron man lady was head-shakingly bad. Zero character development. Zero explanation for how she assembled a friggin Ironman suit in her garage. And her suit in the climax looked like a poor knockoff of Samus Aran from Metroid.
- Namor was a less-compelling Killmonger clone in terms of "revenge against the colonizers" motive. I hardly felt a thing for him or his people good or bad. It's like they realized they goofed by killing Killmonger and so they tried a do-over where Killmonger v2 lives, but Killmonger v2 sucks and I hope we never see him again.
- Speaking of Namor living, the abrupt decision to end the fighting was not earned. We didn't see any reason for Shuri to have this epiphany of "let them live." She just went from "Namor must die" to "lol nevermind" because the scriptwriter realized it was time for the movie to end (and this inexplicably happened AFTER the Marvel Navi had killed hundreds of wakandans on that stupid ship.)
- The attack on Wakanda was … what the heck was that? You know they're attacking by water, you say you're closing the waterways, but they still get in no problem? And what was with all the random water explosions in the city - had the Marvel Navi dropped cherry bombs down all the toilets?
- Mid credit scene was a big MEH.
- The script had no idea what it was doing with Martin freeman or Julia Louis-Dreyfus
- Nobody could fill the hole that Chadwick Boseman's death left in this cast

I really hope other folks enjoyed this more than I did. The first black Panther is a top-5 marvel movie for me, but the sequel is bottom-5 material.
Thanks and gig'em
TCTTS
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Aggie_Journalist said:

I really hope I'm in the minority on this, but this is as underwhelmed as I've ever been by a Marvel film.

There was some good
- Angela Bassett was nails
- The moments of Shuri dealing with her grief, hurt, and anger were compelling, start to finish
- The surprise cameo from Killmonger was a great "Wow!" Moment and perfectly upped the ante on the conflict within shuri

But most of the movie just didn't click for me at all
- The action was all forgettable
- Everything about the iron man lady was head-shakingly bad. Zero character development. Zero explanation for how she assembled a friggin Ironman suit in her garage. And her suit in the climax looked like a poor knockoff of Samus Aran from Metroid.
- Namor was a less-compelling Killmonger clone in terms of "revenge against the colonizers" motive. I hardly felt a think for him or his people good or bad. It's like they realized they goofed by killing Killmonger and so they tried a do-over where Killmonger v2 lives, but Killmonger v2 sucks and I hope we never see him again.
- Speaking if Namor living, the abrupt decision to end the fighting was not earned. We didn't see any reason for Shuri to have this epiphany of "let them live." She just went from "Namor must die" to "lol nevermind" because the scriptwriter realized it was time for the movie to end (and this inexplicably happened AFTER the Marvel Navi had killed hundreds of wakandans on that stupid ship.)
- The attack on Wakanda was … what the heck was that? You know they're attacking by water, you say you're closing the waterways, but they still get in no problem? And what was with all the random water explosions in the city - had the Marvel Navi dropped cherry bombs down all the toilets?
- Mid credit scene was a big MEH.
- The script had no idea what it was doing with Martin freeman or Julia Louis-Dreyfus
- Nobody could fill the hole that Chadwick Boseman's death left in this cast

I really hope other folks enjoyed this more than I did. The first black Panther is a top-5 marvel movie for me, but the sequel is bottom-5 material.

I agree with almost all of this, save for the bolded, as I thought that was an incredibly moving bookend. I will say, though, despite its shortcomings, I still somehow ended up liking this one more than the original. It's an incredibly clunky movie (though, understandably so, given the circumstances), but IMO far more interesting and emotional than Black Panther, which I wasn't a huge fan of to begin with (it was... fine). Granted, interesting doesn't necessary = well executed. All I can say is that, for whatever reasons, I had a more enjoyable time watching this movie, despite its (many) flaws. But yeah, I'm still in agreement with basically everything said above. It's an emotional ride for sure (I definitely teared up more than once), but doesn't really stand up to much scrutiny after the fact, I'm afraid.
TCTTS
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Best part of the night, honestly, was in the immediate wake of the *seven* trailers that played. By the time the green preview band came up for the seventh time, the audience kind of laughed and groaned. But then right after that trailer (Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania), the lights came up and everyone really groaned, thinking there was some kind of malfunction. That's when the host (yes, the host - the Chinese Theater IMAX has a guy on a mic who introduces the movie at every showing) walked back out, with some security guys flanking him, everyone suddenly realized what was happening, and absolutely lossed their minds. The host introduced director Ryan Coogler, along with the producer (sorry, I don't remember his name), who each took a mic, said a few words of gratitude... and then introduced Angela Bassett. Every phone in the theater came out, the whole place stood up, and then gave a standing ovation for a good 30 seconds or so. It was a really, really cool moment, and set the tone for a fun night with a packed crowd of 800+ who were super into the movie.

Best shots I could get...


fig96
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That's awesome.

Our trailers were literally the "which movie is Jonathan Majors going to win an award for" show. We got Devotion, Creed III, and Quantumania with Shazam and Avatar in the middle.
fig96
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I thought it was pretty clear that Shuri had an epiphany after seeing the parallels between her and Namor and realized she didn't want to become that, it was a bit sudden but started with her trying to get over having seen Killmonger when she took the heart shaped herb.

I personally enjoyed most of the action sequences and loved how Namor moved, but to each their own.

I'm with TCTTS on the end credits scene, totally didn't see it coming and loved it.
imjustsayin
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So one thing I didn't get or somehow missed was the black panther fight scene very near the end when Winston duke (Mbaku) shows up and wants to fight for the BP mantle… but Shuri doesn't show up. It felt like it was going to lead to something but then we never saw it again.

That scene was what I was wondering about the moment Chadwick Bozeman passed and how they would handle that tradition with Shuri presumably handling the mantle.

Just thought it was wired.
TCTTS
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Yeah, I had no idea what that was about either. There were a few things like that throughout the movie where I was like, "Wait, what?"
fig96
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I did feel like we glossed over the whole Talokan siren/mermaid ability, we touched on it then just moved on. Seems like there could have been some cool mythology interwoven there.
amercer
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I felt like for the 2nd half of the movie they were setting up for Mbaku to take over as king. They kept highlighting him as the wise ruler who cares for his people.

My memory of the 1st movie is a little shaky, but is there some reason the king (or queen) needs to also be the BP? Seems like you wouldn't want your head of state always off fighting supervillains. Plus it takes a lot of her plate for the new TV show.

When I saw that last scene I just assumed that Mbaku and Suri had agreed to that deal. Would have been nice to have it explicitly stated though so we aren't wondering if they need to fight or something.
coldmoose
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I really enjoyed this movie. Not everything hit 100%, but there was so much that I did like.
And there some really emotional moments.
MBAR
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That scene at the end is Mbaku being the King of Wakanda. That isn't for the black panther mantle. If you think back to Civil war, TChalla's father is king but TChalla is black panther. I think there is a similar set up in this film.
MBAR
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fig96 said:

I thought it was pretty clear that Shuri had an epiphany after seeing the parallels between her and Namor and realized she didn't want to become that, it was a bit sudden but started with her trying to get over having seen Killmonger when she took the heart shaped herb.

I personally enjoyed most of the action sequences and loved how Namor moved, but to each their own.

I'm with TCTTS on the end credits scene, totally didn't see it coming and loved it.
I do think this is correct, but I'm not going to fault people who didn't like it because it honestly gave me big Batman v Superman Martha vibes.
Cinco Ranch Aggie
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We saw this earlier today.

What I liked - the emotional arc from Shuri, and Namor.
What I hated - the child prodigy, the subplot with Elaine Benes and Bilbo Baggins, and Shuri's sudden abandonment of revenge.
What I loved - the mid-credits scene. In fact, this was the best 2 minutes of the movie.

Ok, since Endgame, we've had Spider-Man: No Way Home, Black Widow, Shang-Chi, Eternals, Doctor Strange in the Mouth of Madness (I think that is the title), Thor: Love and Thunder, and Wakanda Forever. There is a whole lot of meh in there. Spider-Man is the best of those by far. I enjoyed parts of BW and much of Shang-Chi, hated Eternals, and then these last 3 have just been middling disappointments. I'm sure I won't actually stop seeing these in the theater but with some of those, I should have just waited for Disney+.
#FJB
Jim01
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Saw it this afternoon with the kids (14,11, 10) and we all liked the first one better but enjoyed it.

Agree there were a lot of loose threads in the movie, stuff that wasn't explained. It didn't feel like 2:40 but at the same time was a bit slow in sections.

THANK YOU to the person that compared the prodigies suit to Metroid. Dead on. That and the new guards suits just looks kind of corny power rangers like to me.

I feel like the Universe aspect of MCU is taking its toll on these movies. Like they are forced to put stuff in like "We need to reveal a bit of who Julis Louis is, because we haven't explained that in the TV show she's been in" even though it's got nothing to do with this movie at all. And on the other hand they play fast and lose like "hey the prodigies going home even though we haven't dealt even a little with the plot point that the US government is after her to help them get vibranium, but we'll just have Lataetia tell her she took care of it because we can think of something later and stuck it in a movie somewhere down the line and leave it hanging." The movies have too much in them that doesn't serve the movie itself. I feel like the early MCU movies did a much better job of making a movie it's own movie.

Fun movie experience it not one of the upper tier Marvel movies for sure.

Side note: We had Devotion as a preview and my kids one by one "That looks like Top Gun." "And there's the guy from Top Gun!" "And they're talking about being wingman an even flying low around snowy mountains!"
rhutton125
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I think I agree with everything everyone has said in this thread, the good and the bad. Some of this may be skewed by a disruptive viewing experience courtesy of Alamo Drafthouse:

Good:
- Performances were all strong
- Namor was solid. As this board's #1 Namor Fan I can say that he's very different than the comic book version (comics Namor is infinitely more proud and haughty - they would have gone to war within 30 seconds), but he's more cunning, charismatic and likeable. That anyone besides me left the theater saying "I want more Namor" is pretty cool. And him hurling that helicopter into the sea was classic Namor - I was cheesing out at that.
- Appropriately emotional at times. I thought it'd dwell on T'Challa more than it did, actually, but perhaps doing so would have dragged the film down.

Not so good:
- Riri Williams didn't do anything for me at all, which is a shame. This is where Alamo Drafthouse may be partly to blame because I missed several punchlines, robbing her of some likeability. I saw Ryan Coogler say that Riri is kind of the audience surrogate, and that she has a complicated relationship with Tony Stark, and we didn't get any of that at all. You can't be an audience surrogate if you show up 45 minutes into the film - we're already balls-deep into Wakanda politics by then. But either way, I didn't like her suits, I didn't like her doing math out loud or going "woohoo" multiple times. I didn't leave the theater wanting more of her - and yet she's got her own show next year. At least there are a couple cool villains in it, from what I've heard.
- Midnight Angels were dumb and kind of unearned. Everybody gets a supersuit these days.
- Still don't really know what to do with Julia Louis-Dreyfus' character. I feel like her humor and nonchalant-ness can be jarring in some scenes. At least now we also know she's kind of a force to be reckoned with, and that she's CIA?


Ultimately, it's a miracle that this film wasn't infinitely worse, given what happened. I just think they had a few too many characters. When Okoye gets fired, she essentially exits the film, and then Nakia enters the film. They either needed to commit more time to Riri Williams, or commit less time, but as it stands I'm kind of satisfied and have seen her prototype suit and final suit and feel like there's not much for her to do in her own show.

IMO: take out Aneka, the new Dora (and give her energy daggers to Shuri). Maybe replace Riri with Stingray, an actual oceanographer character who doesn't require a story detour and already has a suit. You can race- and gender-swap her if you want, and maybe Riri is her daughter who helped design it or something, if you want to tease that. Then give that added screentime to M'Baku or Talokan, so Namora and Attuma aren't just voiceless goons.
Quad Dog
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Mixed feelings on it for me.

A lot of people taking to each other about loss and grief, which I know was about Boseman and disguised as about Tchalla, but there were one or two too many.

Angela Bassett was great in this.

Nyongo was gorgeous on the island. Why isn't she in more stuff?

Loved Namor, but felt like it just kind of ended and didn't really resolve. It's a bad sign when you need a dozen scenes after the ending to wrap everything up. It means you didn't end well.

Like the original BP , the music, costumes, makeup, afrofuturism we're all amazing.
bluefire579
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Did anyone else's theater decide to put a bunch of ragweed or something in the theaters? My allergies were acting up something fierce, particularly during the Marvel logo and the midcredits scene.

Overall enjoyed it. Absolutely loved how they did Namor, and felt Shuri's arc was well done, and the whole thing was beautifully shot. Also interesting to see them take a much more grounded approach for Namor's city than the very comic-like appearance of Atlantis in Aquaman. Agree with several of the complaints here: a few too many characters, liked Riri but felt a bit tacked on, definitely felt the length at times (especially my bladder toward the end), and the ending fight felt a bit rushed. They also did the removing the mask midfight thing a bit too much.
TyHolden
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I watched this before the game knowing that it would go right up until kickoff. I was nervous about missing kickoff and couldn't really focus. In the end, I thought it was good, about what I expected, but waay too long. This might have been my wanting to get out of there as soon as possible. Will watch again though. Hindsight, I wish I would have watched it again then and there without watching the game.
 
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