*** STAR WARS: THE RISE OF SKYWALKER ***

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TCTTS
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In reply to bobinator • 3:45p, 6/14/19
AG
bobinator said:
So we basically think it's something like this?

- There's an army of the republic, but in classic Star Wars bureaucratic tradition they aren't doing anything about The First Order, who are amassing strength at the edge of the Galaxy, taking prisoners to turn into Stormtroopers, and also building a secret weapon.

- Leia, like her mother, gets upset that they aren't doing anything and decides to lead a rag tag band of people who can see the true threat of the First Order

- The First Order decides they're powerful enough to make a move and wipes out the entire republic and its military (the attack is super effective!) in one strike

- The Resistance attacks the First Order, wipes out their super secret weapon, and in response the First Order goes after The Resistance

- Now at this point, the First Order COULD just stop chasing the resistance and start taking over the galaxy or settling down to its favorite past-time with some hot and heavy trade negotiations, but they're (now led by Kylo Ren) obsessed with wiping out the Resistance first?

- So maybe TROS begins with a galaxy in chaos (are we even still using republic credits? did they bring those back? is it SithCoin now or what are we doing?), maybe Hux has control over most of the First Order and they're going around taking over systems while Ren is hunting down Rey? (Because at this point there really isn't a 'resistance' there's just 'a handful of people on this ship with Rey.')

That about the gist of it? Do we need any more than that?

Exactly. Except they should have actually shown those first couple bullet points, and made the FO just a bit more of a mystery at the outset.
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bobinator
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In reply to TCTTS • 3:56p, 6/14/19
AG
It also should have been more important to give the new ones context.

You can start without context, that's fine. In the very first movie, it doesn't really matter that much what the empire is all about. They're bad, our guys are good, let's go.

But when you end a trilogy with the good guys winning, you need more context as to why when we rejoin our good guys, things aren't good.
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TCTTS
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In reply to bobinator • 3:58p, 6/14/19
AG
So true, and a great point.
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Brian Earl Spilner
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In reply to TCTTS • 4:40p, 6/14/19
AG
Are you disagreeing that the mythology of Star Wars has grown exponentially since 1977? I mean, it's pretty much objectively true.

If you want to say that it gave all the context that was ever needed, then that's another thing.

But consider the fact that you'd never know about the following if Star Wars ended with that movie:

The Sith
Emperor Palpatine
Yoda, or ANY Jedi besides Obi-Wan
Jabba the Hutt, Boba Fett, etc
The Old Republic
Clone Wars
Padme
Etc

I do wonder how we would look at that movie in a total vacuum where nothing else Star Wars ever existed.

In any case, I understand / respect your perspective.
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TCTTS
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In reply to Brian Earl Spilner • 4:45p, 6/14/19
AG
I guess I should have been more specific that I was referring only to the context of the Empire/Rebel dynamic, since that's what the article was comparing the First Order/Resistance to. I just meant that outside of A New Hope, I didn't need other movies/books to understand the the basic bad team/good team dynamic. In TFA, however, it's just murkier, that's all.
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redline248
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4:53p, 6/14/19
AG
How does everyone interpret "The First Order reigns?"

My feeling was that they already swooped in to key systems.
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G Martin 87
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In reply to redline248 • 5:04p, 6/14/19
AG
redline248 said:
How does everyone interpret "The First Order reigns?"

My feeling was that they already swooped in to key systems.
It's not specific, but implies that the FO controls most, if not all, of the OT galaxy. I'm completely in agreement with the article and TCTTS on this point. The opening context for TFA should be much clearer than it is.
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redline248
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In reply to TCTTS • 5:06p, 6/14/19
AG
TCTTS said:
I guess I should have been more specific that I was referring only to the context of the Empire/Rebel dynamic, since that's what the article was comparing the First Order/Resistance to. I just meant that outside of A New Hope, I didn't need other movies/books to understand the the basic bad team/good team dynamic. In TFA, however, it's just murkier, that's all.


I really don't think it's murky, the viewer knows pretty quick who is good and bad once the First Order shows up and starts killing people.

The problem is that the movie really can't be viewed in a vacuum. Most of the audience knows what Stormtroopers are, what the republic is and that the good guys fly X Wings.

So even if we didn't actively question things, in our minds we were going "wait, didn't the empire lose? Where did these guys come from?"

Naming the good guys the Resistance was pretty lame and didn't help matters, imo.
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redline248
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In reply to G Martin 87 • 5:08p, 6/14/19
AG
G Martin 87 said:
redline248 said:
How does everyone interpret "The First Order reigns?"

My feeling was that they already swooped in to key systems.
It's not specific, but implies that the FO controls most, if not all, of the OT galaxy. I'm completely in agreement with the article and TCTTS on this point. The opening context for TFA should be much clearer than it is.


Yes, and part of the issue is that it looks like the movie starts only days after the end of Awakens. But the FO already took control of everything? No one else in the galaxy put up a fight or wanted to help the resistance?
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TCTTS
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In reply to redline248 • 5:11p, 6/14/19
AG
Who's good and who's bad isn't murky. That's not what I mean. I'm talking about the context and dynamics.
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redline248
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In reply to TCTTS • 6:24p, 6/14/19
AG
TCTTS said:
Who's good and who's bad isn't murky. That's not what I mean. I'm talking about the context and dynamics.


Ok, so this goes back to what I said about the movie not being in a vacuum. What I should have added was that I think Disney and JJ relied on the viewers' past knowledge to fill in the gaps. Which ended up being problematic. We live in a time where people want more details.
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redline248
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6:26p, 6/14/19
AG
Another issue is the 30 year gap. Everyone wants to know how all the things got to that point, which is really hard to do in a 2.5 hour movie.
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TCTTS
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In reply to redline248 • 6:26p, 6/14/19
AG
Agreed.
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Liquid Wrench
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In reply to TCTTS • 6:31p, 6/14/19
TCTTS said:
Who's good and who's bad isn't murky. That's not what I mean. I'm talking about the context and dynamics.
I don't care about the expanded universe or spending 8 hours on Wookiepedia. The movies themselves, up to this point, have given basically no explanation for the rise of the New Order and collapse of the republican alliance since RotJ.
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Render
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7:26p, 6/14/19
AG
It's almost as if Disney's studio notes demanded that the military conflict in the sequels arbitrarily match the military conflict in the OT (little good guy vs big bad guy) in order to achieve marketing purposes.

But this is a cadre of passionate filmmakers, they wouldn't do that - we just need to trust their vision.
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TCTTS
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In reply to Render • 7:42p, 6/14/19
AG
Agree with the first part, hard disagree on the second part. "Passion" doesn't equal "planning."
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cbr
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In reply to Brian Earl Spilner • 7:53p, 6/14/19
AG
Brian Earl Spilner said:
Wait...what?

First Order is the remnants of the Empire, which slowly built up power between ROTJ and TFA.

The Resistance is a non-Republic-sanctioned army led by Leia, meant to prevent the FO from retaking the galaxy.

What more detail is needed? (Legit asking.)

Edit: If the complaint is how is the First Order in power, I would assume that'll be explained om TROS, given the fact that in TLJ, it's just been a few days since the Capital was destroyed.

I'm sure the crawl will give us that information. (How the First Order was able to take full control after the power vacuum was created.)
Lol no. The first order and snopes are nothing but cheap, farcical reboots of the empire because they literally coundnt come up with anything else worth a ****, other than 'lets make an even bigger dumbass death star and blow it up again using even dumber plot devices and have a new empire but this time with childish goofballs in charge'

And i say that as a guy that loved the first 3 and enjoyed tfa....and i LOVED r1.
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Liquid Wrench
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In reply to TCTTS • 8:17p, 6/14/19
TCTTS said:
Agree with the first part, hard disagree on the second part. "Passion" doesn't equal "planning."
I feel certain Render was being a little facetious with the second part.

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Brian Earl Spilner
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In reply to cbr • 8:19p, 6/14/19
AG
What's any of that have to do with what I said?
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Batzarro
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In reply to cbr • 9:28p, 6/14/19
AG
cbr said:
Brian Earl Spilner said:
Wait...what?

First Order is the remnants of the Empire, which slowly built up power between ROTJ and TFA.

The Resistance is a non-Republic-sanctioned army led by Leia, meant to prevent the FO from retaking the galaxy.

What more detail is needed? (Legit asking.)

Edit: If the complaint is how is the First Order in power, I would assume that'll be explained om TROS, given the fact that in TLJ, it's just been a few days since the Capital was destroyed.

I'm sure the crawl will give us that information. (How the First Order was able to take full control after the power vacuum was created.)
Lol no. The first order and snopes are nothing but cheap, farcical reboots of the empire because they literally coundnt come up with anything else worth a ****, other than 'lets make an even bigger dumbass death star and blow it up again using even dumber plot devices and have a new empire but this time with childish goofballs in charge'

And i say that as a guy that loved the first 3 and enjoyed tfa....and i LOVED r1.


Absolutely right. In no way is there a shred of originality in TFA. However, the hollywood establishment thinks that Jj Abrams, Rian johnson, and D&D are geniuses
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Render
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In reply to TCTTS • 9:39p, 6/14/19
AG
I was being sarcastic on that last part. Should have made it more clear in hindsight.
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Urban Ag
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1:46a, 6/17/19
AG
The right answer is the most simple answer.

This new trilogy sucks. Period.

It's terribly written across the board. Let's just put the characters and the story to the side. And they suck.

The criticism is legitimate. The OT made it painfully obvious what the state of the galaxy is/was. The new trilogy does not. What else can be said.

I will be in the theater for Ep9 no matter what, and sincerely hope JJ pulls it off, but this has been mostly a disaster so far.

PS - Rogue One is the second best SW movie of all time. Solo is good. thanks

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Render
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In reply to Urban Ag • 2:08a, 6/17/19
AG
Urban Ag said:
The right answer is the most simple answer.

This new trilogy sucks. Period.

It's terribly written across the board. Let's just put the characters and the story to the side. And they suck.

The criticism is legitimate. The OT made it painfully obvious what the state of the galaxy is/was. The new trilogy does not. What else can be said.

I will be in the theater for Ep9 no matter what, and sincerely hope JJ pulls it off, but this has been mostly a disaster so far.

PS - Rogue One is the second best SW movie of all time. Solo is good. thanks


C'mon people. So tried of seeing this. The only reason y'all say that is because there was lots of space battle 'splosions with X-Wings and Darth Vader killed some dudes with his lightsaber. Are y'all really going to put action (albeit good action) over genuine meaningful moments from the OT? Just having the binary sunset in IV, and the confrontation between Luke and the Emperor in VI, puts those movies way above R1, imo. (I'm assuming you're putting Empire first.)

I guess I just watch these movies for different reasons compared to most y'all.
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Urban Ag
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In reply to Render • 2:11a, 6/17/19
AG
ok
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Render
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In reply to Urban Ag • 2:12a, 6/17/19
AG
alright
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Belton Ag
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In reply to Render • 6:25a, 6/17/19
AG
Quote:
C'mon people. So tried of seeing this. The only reason y'all say that is because there was lots of space battle 'splosions with X-Wings and Darth Vader killed some dudes with his lightsaber. Are y'all really going to put action (albeit good action) over genuine meaningful moments from the OT? Just having the binary sunset in IV, and the confrontation between Luke and the Emperor in VI, puts those movies way above R1, imo. (I'm assuming you're putting Empire first.)
I'm equally tired of seeing the pretentious, arrogant dismissal of people who do think Rogue One was a good movie as a bunch of mouth breathers that like 'splosions.

As if the underlying story of redemption and sacrifice mean nothing. As if Rogue One doesn't enhance the viewing of - and doesn't give extra meaning to - Episode Four.

It's not just about 'splosions. If you're tired of seeing it then you can hop off the thread. No one will miss you, I promise.
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Brian Earl Spilner
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In reply to Urban Ag • 6:48a, 6/17/19
AG
Quote:
Period.
Damn it. He's won, guys.
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maca1028
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7:09a, 6/17/19
Lots of replies...no new set photos, trailers, or posters!? WTH!
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jokershady
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7:10a, 6/17/19
AG
Rogue One damn near moved me to tears.

'nuff said for me
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redline248
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9:31a, 6/17/19
AG
I just don't see the point of arguing with anyone that liked a movie more than me, or vice versa.






Unless it's that pile of crap last jedi
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Urban Ag
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In reply to Brian Earl Spilner • 10:08a, 6/17/19
AG
Brian Earl Spilner said:
Quote:
Period.
Damn it. He's won, guys.
I finally won!

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cbr
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In reply to Render • 10:22a, 6/17/19
AG
Render said:
Urban Ag said:
The right answer is the most simple answer.

This new trilogy sucks. Period.

It's terribly written across the board. Let's just put the characters and the story to the side. And they suck.

The criticism is legitimate. The OT made it painfully obvious what the state of the galaxy is/was. The new trilogy does not. What else can be said.

I will be in the theater for Ep9 no matter what, and sincerely hope JJ pulls it off, but this has been mostly a disaster so far.

PS - Rogue One is the second best SW movie of all time. Solo is good. thanks


C'mon people. So tried of seeing this. The only reason y'all say that is because there was lots of space battle 'splosions with X-Wings and Darth Vader killed some dudes with his lightsaber. Are y'all really going to put action (albeit good action) over genuine meaningful moments from the OT? Just having the binary sunset in IV, and the confrontation between Luke and the Emperor in VI, puts those movies way above R1, imo. (I'm assuming you're putting Empire first.)

I guess I just watch these movies for different reasons compared to most y'all.
If only we were all as sophisticated in our taste for kids movies as you.
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Mac94
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11:35a, 6/17/19
AG
Quote:
'mon people. So tried of seeing this. The only reason y'all say that is because there was lots of space battle 'splosions with X-Wings and Darth Vader killed some dudes with his lightsaber. Are y'all really going to put action (albeit good action) over genuine meaningful moments from the OT? Just having the binary sunset in IV, and the confrontation between Luke and the Emperor in VI, puts those movies way above R1, imo. (I'm assuming you're putting Empire first.)

I guess I just watch these movies for different reasons compared to most y'all.

The X-wings and Darth Vader helped make Rouge One a fun flick ... but it was a good story that fit and added to the OT quite well. It's tone and humor fit well and it added context to both the Rebellion and the Empire.

ANH and Empire are the top two .... but Rouge is better, IMHO, than Return of the Jedi. It is the one Disney film that stands out as a classic Star Wars film.
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The Collective
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In reply to jokershady • 12:35p, 6/17/19
AG
jokershady said:
Rogue One damn near moved me to tears.


I am secure enough to admit I teared up during this scene.
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Brian Earl Spilner
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In reply to Mac94 • 12:40p, 6/17/19
AG
Rouge One, standing by.
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