The Alienist

4,559 Views | 32 Replies | Last: 6 yr ago by birdman
Chipotlemonger
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AG
One of my favorite books, if not most favorite, is getting a TV rendition. This is the first I believe that I've heard about this.

Anyone else highly regard the book? Not sure what my feelings to this are.

Sex Panther
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AG
Never heard of the book, and don't give TNT much credit in the original shows department, but it does look interesting and has a good cast.
FL_Ag1998
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AG
Oh wow, loved the book, might have to give this a try.
SeattleAgJr
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he does not look alienist.
Sapper Redux
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I enjoyed the book quite a bit. Hopefully they can put together a good series, but I'd be more excited if HBO, Netflix, or AMC was doing it.
Clavell
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AG
Also one of my favorite books. Been waiting for this, but expect to be disappointed.
PatAg
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AG
Sex Panther said:

Never heard of the book, and don't give TNT much credit in the original shows department, but it does look interesting and has a good cast.
My exact thoughts
rynning
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AG
Just finished the book based on this thread. Took me a few chapters, but I was hooked. Serious, honest, and surprisingly fast-paced for its length.
Clavell
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AG
The author Caleb Carr is a very interesting guy himself. Really a militarily historian mainly. After reading The Alienist. I kept reading his novels and while none reached that level they were worth the time.

Other Kreizler books:
The Angel of Darkness - good sequel
Surrender, New York - another in series, but mostly upper New York

The Italian Secretary - a so so Sherlock Homes story

The Legend of Broken - A try at fantasy, just couldn't get into it totally

The Devil Soldier - a very interesting non-fiction biography of a American soldier in 19th century China


"Facts no longer exist. Everything is a "point of view" now."
Daniel Suarez's 2011 "Freedom"
rynning
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AG
It premiered on TNT tonight. Anyone else tune in?

Liked:
- Production values -- didn't look cheap
- Cinematography -- well shot; felt like the grimy, turn-of-the-century New York depicted in the book
- Story -- very close to the book so far, though not as graphic (e.g., included that genitals were "removed" but not where they were put) More sex than the book had...

Didn't like:
- Pace -- the pace is slow, maybe too slow if you haven't read the book
- Acting -- average so far; Dakota Fanning is good, but the Sara Howard character is probably the best role in the first episode too; the Roosevelt character was most disappointing to me

So far: B-

The previews of future episodes look pretty good, so hopefully the pace picks up and it gets more interesting.
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Buck O Five
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AG
It appeared to me the filter they shot it through made the picture quality look poor. Anyone else?
Clavell
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AG
Saw first episode. Did move a bit slow, but thought did good job of bringing the feel of 1890s NYC.


"Facts no longer exist. Everything is a "point of view" now."
Daniel Suarez's 2011 "Freedom"
LHIOB
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AG
I enjoyed it and Im looking forward to seeing where it goes

That said no book stuff here please
ag88man
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AG
rynning said:

the Roosevelt character was most disappointing to me
If he was the Harvard friend in the police department with the file they wanted, that guy sounded like a robot.
rynning
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AG
ag88man said:

rynning said:

the Roosevelt character was most disappointing to me
If he was the Harvard friend in the police department with the file they wanted, that guy sounded like a robot.
That's the one. In the book, the character was a boisterous, take-no-prisoners braveheart. Not so much in the series so far...
AJ02
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AG
Finally watched it last night. I thought in general, the acting was bad. Especially Roosevelt's character. I know Dakota Fanning is a great actress, but it felt like everyone was over-acting.

I love these kinds of psychological shows, especially those from the late 1800s- early 1900s. So I really want to like this one. I was underwhelmed by the first episode though.
KidDoc
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AG
I enjoyed it. I thought the settings and cinematography were great.

I do agree with the over-acting though, seemed a bit soap opera style acting with pauses and hyperbolic nuance.

I plan to watch a few more at least to see how it pans out.
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rynning
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AG
Just watched episode 2. Same slow pace. Same average acting. Showed two people having sex, and I have no idea who they were. Moved the story forward a couple of days I think, so there's that.

I'm thinking I just can't watch a movie when I've already read the book. But I liked Shawshank Redemption, so maybe it's not me.

#onemoreepisode
LHIOB
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AG
Yeah its losing me...
ro828
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In my humble opinion, the cinematography was terrible. The lighting is very dim, possibly in an effort to hide the fact that the show is filmed in Hungary. In way too many scenes a character would be in an extremely dark room standing in front of a window or open door through which sunlight is shining. I'll grant that the story is interesting, and watching it sent me to Google to find out more about Theodore Roosevelt's tenure as Police Commissioner.
Liquid Wrench
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Just checking this out. The lady boys are weirding me out man.

Agree about the dark filter, looks like they borrowed the period piece lens from AMC or History Channel.

Glad to see TNT investing more in quality originals.
AJ02
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AG
I watched the first episode of the series because it intrigued me. But, I thought the acting was bad and im having a hard time convincing myself to watch the next episode.

But I've heard the book is great. So I bought it today. Debating whether I should just go ahead and read the book, or plug through the show and then read the book. Thoughts?
annie88
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AG
I think it's been pretty good so far. I never compare theatrical presentations to books though there's just no point. Your most almost always be disappointed so just let it stand on its own. Now if you just don't enjoy the show that's one thing but I think it's pretty good.
KidDoc
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AG
I'm enjoying this series now through three episodes. I think the cinematography really sets the mood and is appropriate for 19th century New York. The stark contrast when they attend the rich party with electric lights is a wonderful contrast to the rest of the series that is candle or gas lit.

The subject matter is fairly disturbing, which the show does not make a secret of from the beginning. I do like the mixture of CSI with corruption and 19th century setting so I'll watch this one to completion for sure.
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birdman
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Stumbled onto the book about twenty years ago. It's been one of my favorites ever since then.

I think this series is really good. Sticking to the story for the most part. It's gruesome and awful at times.

Only thing that didn't ring true to me is Teddy Roosevelt, as mentioned already.
rynning
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AG
Is anyone still watching this series?

I stopped for a few weeks because I was bored, but decided to try again from the DVR. It's actually getting more interesting, especially because of some of the choices they made which deviate from the book. There's much less time spent at the chalkboard and more time spent with the suspects. There are other minor differences (e.g., why is Moore an artist instead of a reporter?) that don't matter as much.

Anyway, I'm back in and would encourage others to not give up yet...

Edited to add that I still think the Roosevelt character was badly miscast.
Trident 88
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AG
I'm still watching but considering quitting. The last episode was better than most, but it's still not very exciting. Plus, Dakota Fanning is a robot.
Duncan Idaho
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This show just makes me miss the Knick
AJ02
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AG
I actually really loved the Knick. I think they should've dragged out his drug addiction longer than one season before sending him to rehab. It started going downhill as soon as they did that.

I've finished the book (the Alienist) and liked it. Went back to start watching the series. I've gotten through two episodes and it's just not holding my attention. At what point does it get better?
rynning
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AG
AJ02 said:

I've finished the book (the Alienist) and liked it. Went back to start watching the series. I've gotten through two episodes and it's just not holding my attention. At what point does it get better?

Episode 3 is more of the same, 4 gets better, and 5 is pretty good. Can't imagine many getting that far though...
damfino
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I guess I'm in the minority, but am loving this series so far--last two episodes were written by John Sayles! Love the pace, the atmosphere, and the three leads. I read the book when it came out, but had forgotten a lot of detail. Last episode finally getting close to the murderer after the team splits up.

Also, TNT has 2-3 featurettes on different aspects of turn-of-the-century New York and policing through the centuries. Very moving episode on Hart Island where paupers and unclaimed bodies have been buried since 1869.
rynning
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AG
Well I finished the series. Good final episode. Both Miss Howard (Dakota Fanning) and Theodore Roosevelt characters showed more personality which had been severely lacking in earlier episodes. That probably goes for Dr. Kreizler as well. Maybe the actors were more relaxed and happy things were coming to an end, assuming they filmed in series order.

I'd give the series a B- but probably an A- if I hadn't read the book and knew what was coming.
Pignorant
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AG
I enjoyed the series.

For book readers, did the show deviate from the book at all?
birdman
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Here are the differences as I remember. But it's been 20 years since I've read it, so I may have them all wrong. Not many major discrepancies. I don't know how to block spoilers in my post, so be warned.

In the book, Roosevelt was more involved in the investigation. They would meet at Delmonico's nearly every night and recap the case.

John Moore was crime reporter for newspaper. So he knew all the players in the underworld and how to get around. They downplayed that in the tv show.

I don't remember the rich pedophile with silver teeth at all. They investigated some rich folks in the book, got some flak from mayor, JP Morgan, etc. But they had hundreds of suspects.

I don't remember the pregnant Jewish girl.

The final scene was different. I recall that they figured out where he was going ahead of time. They sent the cops on wild goose chase, but entire crew went to the holding ponds and trapped him.

I don't remember him kidnapping their acquaintance Joseph. I think he just grabbed another kid like he did previously.

The dirty cop shot John Beechum and he turned on them. But it wasn't Sarah that killed him. It was the Italian pimp or his men. Kretzer's bunch had been using him as deep undercover body guard.

The final scene was different. Beechum was trying to communicate but his face contortions were too strong. Not sure why they didn't include that scene.

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