Star Wars Discussion Thread

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AliasMan02
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quote:
Yea, Snoke definitely calls him 'master of the knights of ren'. I don't recall if it is early on when Snoke references Kylo's father Han Solo or if it is when Snoke is chiding him for being bested by Rey's mind reading skills.

I know we have has ed over this in the past, and I'm sure we will another 100x...
That vision can only be the past if Rey was actually not present. It's not real clear in the film if she was there, though they definitely make it seem that way. Also, if the vision is tied to the lightsaber, doesn't it need to be post TFA? I really think it is the future. The only hole is Kylo will need a new mask.


Rey wasn't present for anything in the vision except the battle in the snow.
I Have Spoken
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What about the scene in the rain where he stabs someone and then turns and walks toward her?
redline248
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There is just too many things possible to even bother with speculation.
AliasMan02
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quote:
There is just too many things possible to even bother with speculation.


It's part of the fun!
I Have Spoken
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quote:
There is just too many things possible to even bother with speculation.


Well, that seems boring.
redline248
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AliasMan02
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I'm sure we've done this, but wth... Here is the whole scene from the script.


Rey is heartsick, but she turns as she hears the sound of a young girl in anguish, crying. She follows the sound into the castle, turning so she can't see that Finn has looked back at her one last time.

INT. MAZ' CASTLE - BASEMENT CORRIDOR - DAY

Rey steps down into the basement corridor. BB-8 follows her. Walking carefully and confused, she is not sure why she's down here. She can hear the echoing sounds of a young girl crying. She heads down the hall... to the very end, where there is a door. It is almost as if a SOULFUL VIBRATION draws her closer. She looks at the door lock -- AND THE DOOR OPENS. Hesitant, Rey enters.

INT. MAZ'S CASTLE - CRYPT ROOM - DAY

Rey moves into the dark, small, vaulted storage room. Old treasures line the floors and walls, but there is something specific Rey is drawn to: on a table, an old wooden BOX.

She moves to it, unsure, afraid, as if an energy from inside the box has been calling her here. BB-8 nervously follows.

Rey reaches out, very slowly, to touch the box. A moment heavy with tension.

Rey OPENS THE BOX and sees inside Luke Skywalker's original lightsaber. With hesitation, she reaches towards it, but she cannot resist. As her hand makes contact with it, there is the piercing sound of a lightsaber igniting. She moves her hand away, as REY HEARS A MECHANICAL BREATHING sound.

The CAMERA MOVES, LIGHTING CHANGES -- and we see behind her something impossible: a HALLWAY OF FROM DEEP INSIDE CLOUD CITY. Disembodied voices fill the air.

YOUNG GIRL
NO!

She stands -- looks around, confused by all she sees and hears. -- Turns and sees, through a DOORWAY.

We follow Rey and she runs down the corridor, but it all TILTS -- TURNS -- and she lands on the WALL -- which is now the GROUND -- dried GRASS.

She turns to look -- we PIVOT -- and see a BURNING TEMPLE AT NIGHT. We PAN to:

R2-D2 -- who watches the flames -- and a MAN appears (LUKE, whose face we do not see). He falls to his knees, reaches out to the droid -- with a MECHANICAL RIGHT HAND.

We PUSH IN ON REY as RAIN BEGINS -- and DAY TURNS TO NIGHT -- and she LOOKS UP -- we TILT UP -- To see we're LOOKING UP AT A WARRIOR as he is STABBED BY A FIERY LIGHTSABER! He screams and falls to the ground -- we FOLLOW HIM, revealing Rey again, now in a nighttime battlefield. She gets to her feet, frightened by what she sees. We PIVOT AROUND HER to REVEAL KYLO REN, and the six other KNIGHTS OF REN, who flank him!

Come back around to Rey, soaking now, as the RAIN STOPS and SUNLIGHT illuminates her -- she turns to look -- we PIVOT -- and see...

A little girl. Rey as a child. She is sobbing, hysterical.
Unkar Plutt's meaty hand holds her thin arm. She is on Jakku, watching a starship fly into the sky, abandoning her.

YOUNG GIRL
No, come back!

UNKAR PLUTT
Quiet, girl!

The ship flies towards the desert sun, which is strangely eclipsed, as if being eaten by darkness. Rey looks around her to see she is..

In a NIGHTTIME, BARREN, SNOWY WOODS. She's losing her mind, confounded and lost and she gets to her feet, her breath seen in the frigid air -- and then: THE SOUND OF CLASHING LIGHTSABERS! She moves through the woods, toward the sound. Rey runs, heart pounding, when KYLO REN EMERGES FROM BEHINDA TREE! She stops, SCREAMS, FALLS BACK and LANDS IN:

INT. MAZ' CASTLE - BASEMENT CORRIDOR - DAY

She falls back, out of the room, suddenly sitting in the hall, out of breath, alarmed and perplexed.

---

Tough to find a clear common thread. No one party, including the lightsaber, is present at all of these events. Some are in the past. Some are in the future. It's not sequential.

Really the Knights of Ren image is key and the most unknown... Could be the past or future and there is evidence to support both. Assuming the burning temple is the aftermath of Ben Solo's betrayal, we know all of the other events. The only other mystery is who left Rey with Plutt, and why... But obviously that's the big one.
AliasMan02
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Also just to admit, we may be giving JJ too much credit. He's a style over substance guy and it's possible the imagery is just all flash and flavor without much deliberate thought behind it, like his sorta questionable use of lightspeed and hyperspace in TFA. That would be disappointing, though.
I Have Spoken
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Hopefully the story guys gave JJ some hints or ideas on images they wanted in there that would be helpful for the story moving forward.
Simplebay
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TFA


ottc777
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without searching, answer this question.

Why has Natalie Portman not shown the prequels to her son??
TCTTS
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She doesn't want her son to watch her die on screen.
COOL LASER FALCON
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She doesn't hate her son
I Have Spoken
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Probably doesn't want her son to think less of her for actually falling in love with Hayden's rendition of Anakin Skywalker.
AliasMan02
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After our TFA viewing the other night, we were talking about the end of III and I pulled up her death scene on youtube.

Holy S. So terrible. It made NO sense. You could see all the gymnastics Lucas did to try and shoehorn in the ending. She dies (counter to what we know from Jedi, of course) but for no reason, because you can't have her die from the assault by her husband. "We'll just say she loses the will to live. It will be poetic!" Never mind those kids she has to live for.

And it looks terrible, like Obi Wan is standing in front of a painted sheet for a background.

I actually encourage everyone to pull up TFA and watch a scene, then switch over to a prequel. It's shocking. We're so lucky that Lucas sold. SO lucky.
hunter2012
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quote:
After our TFA viewing the other night, we were talking about the end of III and I pulled up her death scene on youtube.

Holy S. So terrible. It made NO sense. You could see all the gymnastics Lucas did to try and shoehorn in the ending. She dies (counter to what we know from Jedi, of course) but for no reason, because you can't have her die from the assault by her husband. "We'll just say she loses the will to live. It will be poetic!" Never mind those kids she has to live for.

And it looks terrible, like Obi Wan is standing in front of a painted sheet for a background.

I actually encourage everyone to pull up TFA and watch a scene, then switch over to a prequel. It's shocking. We're so lucky that Lucas sold. SO lucky.

Palpatine killed her using the force I thought. Honestly I thought Natalie was the worst thing in the prequel trilogy, Haden is actually pretty decent outside of their scenes together. But their chemistry is the worst and it's what most people hate on in the prequel trilogy.
redline248
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quote:
quote:
After our TFA viewing the other night, we were talking about the end of III and I pulled up her death scene on youtube.

Holy S. So terrible. It made NO sense. You could see all the gymnastics Lucas did to try and shoehorn in the ending. She dies (counter to what we know from Jedi, of course) but for no reason, because you can't have her die from the assault by her husband. "We'll just say she loses the will to live. It will be poetic!" Never mind those kids she has to live for.

And it looks terrible, like Obi Wan is standing in front of a painted sheet for a background.

I actually encourage everyone to pull up TFA and watch a scene, then switch over to a prequel. It's shocking. We're so lucky that Lucas sold. SO lucky.

Palpatine killed her using the force I thought. Honestly I thought Natalie was the worst thing in the prequel trilogy, Haden is actually pretty decent outside of their scenes together. But their chemistry is the worst and it's what most people hate on in the prequel trilogy.
Another piece of evidence how terribly Lucas directed those films. An otherwise excellent actor putting in the worst performance of her career. Same with Sam L. Jackson and Christopher Lee.

edit: Palpatine didn't force kill her. How would he have done that? He wouldn't need a death star if he was that powerful.
I Have Spoken
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Honestly I thought Natalie was the worst thing in the prequel trilogy, Haden is actually pretty decent outside of their scenes together. But their chemistry is the worst and it's what most people hate on in the prequel trilogy.


Ewan McGregor. That's the reason Hayden seems alright in his scenes without Natalie Portman.
Ag Since 83
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Bingo. It looked like Ewan had actually watched Star Wars and knew what to aim for and the others had somehow seen Twilight years in advance and were channeling that
hunter2012
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quote:
quote:
quote:
After our TFA viewing the other night, we were talking about the end of III and I pulled up her death scene on youtube.

Holy S. So terrible. It made NO sense. You could see all the gymnastics Lucas did to try and shoehorn in the ending. She dies (counter to what we know from Jedi, of course) but for no reason, because you can't have her die from the assault by her husband. "We'll just say she loses the will to live. It will be poetic!" Never mind those kids she has to live for.

And it looks terrible, like Obi Wan is standing in front of a painted sheet for a background.

I actually encourage everyone to pull up TFA and watch a scene, then switch over to a prequel. It's shocking. We're so lucky that Lucas sold. SO lucky.

Palpatine killed her using the force I thought. Honestly I thought Natalie was the worst thing in the prequel trilogy, Haden is actually pretty decent outside of their scenes together. But their chemistry is the worst and it's what most people hate on in the prequel trilogy.
Another piece of evidence how terribly Lucas directed those films. An otherwise excellent actor putting in the worst performance of her career. Same with Sam L. Jackson and Christopher Lee.

edit: Palpatine didn't force kill her. How would he have done that? He wouldn't need a death star if he was that powerful.

The prevailing theory is he took what he learned from Plaguis and siphoned off Padme's life force to save Vader's. That's why he is revived and she dies at the same time, additionally thats how he knows she's dead when he tells Vader, "I'm afraid in your anger you killed her." If he doesn't know she's dead why build a card house of lies for Vader if she could potentially surface later? Vader would turn on the Emperor immediately if he found out she was still alive and that Palpatine lied to him. There is plenty more out on the web if you want to look it up.
dromo07
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Palp killed Pad
AliasMan02
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Could you remake the prequels, or rather make new movies that replace them, while sticking with the other existing canon? The major sources to maintain would be Clone Wars, Dark Disciple, and Darth Maul - Son of Dathomir.

You're stuck with the clone army, but if modeled after TCW, that would be okay. You're stuck with Anakin being the son of a slave and from Tatooine and the Chosen One. You're stuck with Midi-chlorians due to their reference in three episodes of TCW. You're stuck with the secret marriage between Anakin and Padme.

Still too much to overcome?

Jason Ag
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I think they will remake Vaders origin story eventually. But now they need to continue the story with the old actors while they're still around.
I Have Spoken
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I believe I said this a few pages back... Yea, redo the fall of Anakin at the very least. Let Filoni do it (assuming he would redo George's work)
dromo07
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You really only need to do a better Topher Star Wars cut and we are good to go!
AliasMan02
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quote:
I believe I said this a few pages back... Yea, redo the fall of Anakin at the very least. Let Filoni do it (assuming he would redo George's work)


I don't think Filoni would. He even supports the obviously terrible Mortis and Living Force story arcs that were spawned by Lucas.

Here's a thought, though. Lucas provided Lucasfilm his ideas for episodes 7 through 9 and people from the story group and Kennedy, who are all Lucas devotees, said... "Mmmmm, no thanks." How terrible must that have been?
Brian Earl Spilner
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AliasMan02
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So he IS in Episode IX!
dromo07
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quote:
So he IS in Episode IX!
force ghost like is pops
I Have Spoken
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Spoiler tag this *****
I Have Spoken
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TCTTS
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Unconfirmed news that a character potentially LIVES to the next movie is NOT a spoiler. Good Lord.
tamusc
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quote:
Unconfirmed news that a character potentially LIVES to the next movie is NOT a spoiler. Good Lord.
He's kidding...I think.

I hope.
TCTTS
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I missed the smiley face post.
Brian Earl Spilner
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