Having some landscaping done (flagstone patio and the like) and I will be telling the contractor that he will not be paid until I can see the work done (I will be at work, and they will be finishing around mid-morning tomorrow) and I have a feeling that the job will not be done to the interpretation of the contract.

What am I really looking at if I refuse to pay until the job is done correctly and he says it is done in the manner of the contract?

he can file a mechanics lien on your home for the amount he feel he is owed. My situation currently is a bit different than yours, but if there is a dispute, they have this avenue to collect their money. I know it applies to house remodels, not sure about landscaping but I think it is any type of labor.

In hindsight, the contract should be clear, you should setup distinct/precise payments upon completion of items and perhaps even get them to sign a lien waive agreement prior to the job.

$.02

EDIT: fortunately for me, in the actual contract it states: "Contractor is responsible for satisfactory completion of the work", which I cannot believe they put in there because it gives me a lot of control over being "satisfied". I don't know what yours says.

What city are you in?

The last work I had with a contractor was set up to have payments after certain milestones, and then at then end 20% or less was with held until I was satisfied with the result and punchline was completed. It worked out well for everyone.

Id read the contract and see if you have an avenue but if not. I wouldn't have any problem dragging my feet on payment unail it was done right.

Mechanics liens are not typically free for the "mechanic", and involve a bit of headache to file.

I have seen a mechanics lien filed for work done on the property, but not the physical house. It can be done if they are determined. I'm sure amount will play into this as well. I'm sure it's not worth it to file one over a few hundred dollars, but as you inch closer to 1k, I could definitely see them trying to get paid for work done.

the point of the contract is so that there is no interpretation necessary - in theory.

After re-reading your original comment...if you are so worried, I would be there and not let anything slide. Is there anything in the contract that states "contractor responsibilities" and how this is reflected in the finished work?

Regarding mechanics lien...my situation: Bathroom remodel..as things progressed I noted more and more issues, things left unfinished, things done incorrectly, etc. I brought them to their attention, and they came out to look at them (the business people). I have emails of them admitting they did X, Y and Z wrong, telling me they would put a plan together to resolve them. Day after they asked for a milestone payment, to which I said I would need to understand the plan going forward first. Couple of days later, they terminated the contract (well within their right to do so "for convenience"), claiming I "refused to pay" when in fact all I did is I asked for full itemization of the project to-date (overages on allowances and such).

So, great - looks like they fired themselves. They insisted they were owed money. There is money I owe them, yes, but when I calculate the change order(s) I pre-paid for that had not been done, some items that had not been started that had been part of an earlier milestone - the dollars started to net out onto my side. i.e. I have already paid you enough for the work done. We failed to come to an agreement at mediation. Days later they file a lien for the FULL contract amount.

At this point I am furious. The final milestone on the contract states "upon project completion". Since they did not complete the project, they are not entitled to that payment, so immediately the lien amount filed is grossly over stated. Furthermore, to correct their mistakes (and I have all the photos and building codes to prove what they did is OUT of code), it is going to cost me a ton more money. They want me to pay them full contract amount, then turn around and pay someone else to correct and complete the job. Tell me where I went wrong here. I vetted them through BBB, Angies List and even went onsite to look at a completed remodel they did down the street. Also recommended by other neighbors. I don't know what else I could have done. Thank goodness I was there everyday to catch other things before they got worse.

Still currently in legal discussions...I am in about $3K in legal fees now.

Here is the project in its current state as of tonight. I had the feeling after the furthest section, the one closest to the back porch, that this was going to happen, hence the stay of this thread.



I don't think there's any way he could think this is truly a good job

They are coming back tomorrow to "finish" but that only includes some little things, raising the furthest drain, leveling along the house, getting the red pavers against the edging properly on each end.


Am I totally misguided that there's no way I should pay for this?

well...the story continues to unfold and I let him know the current state of the project is unacceptable and he will be here personally on Monday barring rain to remedy the situation

we still don't know what he was contracted to do.

i am going to guess a stone patio, but there needs to be concerns with drainage/grading and whatever was supposed to go in between the stones.

I do agree - it looks like I did it blindfolded

Acrually the guy was understanding. Didn't go with the lowest bid, went with the mid bid. His guys didn't do the job properly and he admitted to it. Much more understanding than I expected him to be honestly. I was expecting an argument, but he knew his guys screwed up. The contract was for a paver and flagstone patio addition with a drainage system that tied the gutter downspouts to drain them to the road.

Lesson learned to make sure the contract is more thoroughly vetted on our end. This won't happen again I can tell you that

Is understanding enough to redo the whole thing?

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Is understanding enough to redo the whole thing?

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Yes

Those drains in the patio if attached to the gutter downspouts will not drain while it is raining unless you have a huge drain pipe connecting them all.
As a landscaper my self...... that looks like something a homeowner or an unexperienced person would build. Should have considered laying flagstone on top of concrete base and mortoring the flagstone. Crushed granite will wash if water is moving across the patio and will be tracked into your house also.

that is a sad looking patio

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Those drains in the patio if attached to the gutter downspouts will not drain while it is raining unless you have a huge drain pipe connecting them all.
As a landscaper my self...... that looks like something a homeowner or an unexperienced person would build. Should have considered laying flagstone on top of concrete base and mortoring the flagstone. Crushed granite will wash if water is moving across the patio and will be tracked into your house also.

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Care to be a sounding board and answer some questions for me? Email is bgoldgar at gee mail dot com.

Yikes... I kept waiting for the 'after' pictures but that's what I was already looking at.

I'd be concerned whether whatever pipe is under all that and the drains are big enough to handle whatever runoff you might have.

The pipe is the 4 inch corex perforated pipe

Is the intent to plant ground cover type vegetation between the stones? Is that the reason for the gaps? Even if that's the case, it looks like he ran out of rocks way too early.

email me I will give you some info if you need it. keo1 at prodigy dot net

Holy crap.

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What in the actual ****?

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I believe that is what is referred to as "easy money."

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EDIT: fortunately for me, in the actual contract it states: "Contractor is responsible for satisfactory completion of the work", which I cannot believe they put in there because it gives me a lot of control over being "satisfied". I don't know what yours says.

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wow, your contractor is an idiot. You could hold him to "satisfactory completion of work" forever and not pay him.

exactly - how anyone would put that in their contract is beyond me. I think outside of the contract specifically, there would be some "reasonability" aspect to that - i can't just complain to complain and be punitive.

I have a thread from awhile back about all the issues, and my complaints. They aren't minor (like newly built walls out of plumb, poor electrical work, crooked tiles, etc.)

They have liened for the full amount of their contract, while terminating it prior to when final payment was due. That final draw has the clause next to it "upon completion". So in my mind - they are not entitled to that since the job was never completed, yet they put a lien on my home for the full contract amount. It's a mess. I am in for over $3K in legal bills only to have their last "offer" come back to me again for almost the full amount. Don't lose sight of the fact they also left some work unfinished and also damaged my staircase to the tune of $6K-$8K in damages and refuse to take responsibility for it.