We continue to suck in spite of everything else.

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I'm not saying who I think is a better coach, but...

Hugh Freeze ineheirted a 2-10 team that not only went winless in conference, but lost by an average of 24+ points in SEC play.

The 2011 team lost to Vandy by 23. They lost to Kentucky by 27.

In football, not basketball.

Took over a 2-10 team and won 7 games, then 8 games, then 9 games and now has a chance to win a 10th this year. In the last two seasons his team has still been in contention for the SEC title in mid-November.


Sumlin took over a 7-6 team and won 11 games, 9 games, 8 games and now has a chance to win a 9th this year. In his first season his team was in SEC title contention up until the last week of the season (someone correct me if I'm wrong there), but then we were out of title contention by October in the following 3 seasons.


I'm not saying Freeze is a better coach, but I don't think there's any doubt who shows to be trending up.

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Ya know, after re-reading this I can actually make a much better summary:


Kevin Sumlin has been Mark Turgeon.... Took over a very good roster, did decent with it... Came close to getting over the hump (2012 fb somewhat similar to just missing two S16 trips).

Hugh Freeze has been Billy Gillispie... Took over a terrible team and in one year got them to above average, and in the next few years have improved steadily.

Well put.

Freeze still had some terrible loses this year and had their fans yelling for a bunch of staff firings. 38-10 vs Florida, 37-24 vs Memphis, and lost to Arkansas in OT after allowing 53 points.

For the record, that 7-5 Tennessee team finished the regular season 8-4.

Ole Miss is the only team in the SEC West which hasn't played in the SEC Championship Game(A&M is still too new to say this about). Ole Miss hasn't won an SEC Football Title since 1963(they were driving Studebakers). I believe Ole Miss is 2-2 vs. A&M in the last 4 years and Ole Miss splits a small state with both USM & State.

How any of this compares to A&M I truly do not know.

Many want to imply cheating. Just because another SEC team does better than us does not mean they are cheating.

Simply put, they do a better job recruiting than we do.

MS lives with another SEC school in a state with a very small population.

We live in a state as the only SEC university with a much, much larger population. In fact, the combined population of AR, TN, LA, MS, & AL Is less than the population of TX.

We should at least recruit at a much, much higher level than we currently do. Recruiting mostly 3-star athletes will NOT win us the West no matter who our coaches are.
NEVER WILL!

How? What else can we do besides offer money, cash, and hos?

Get better recruiters.

Coaches who can do both (coach & recruit) are worth a ton of cash. We have to find them and hire them.

Coaches who can do both are well known to all other coaches and individuals who hire such coaches (or definitely should be known).

We have so much to offer coaches (and recruits) to come here such as rabid fans, incredible facilities, high academics, strong support system, etc., etc., etc.

We are in the center of probably the strongest area in the country of high quality football recruits -- around 20 million people live within a 200 mile radius of us.

We got Chavis here. We can recruit others.

I believe our bigggest setback over the past four years was Sumlin keeping Snyder an extra year when it was obvious he was a terrible coach. It killed our defense from which we have still not recovered.

Will our second biggest setback be Sumlin keeping Spavital an extra year when it is obvious he is NOT a decent OC? Will Spavital be kept an extra year and set back our offense even farther that will take us a few years to recover from?

At a bar in Baton Rouge on Friday night, I struck up a conversation with an LSU fan and we started talking recruiting. They had just lost Feliepe Franks, so I asked if there was any chance that could flip Shea Patterson from Ole Miss since he had previously played HS ball in Louisiana before transferring to IMG Academy.

Dude's response: "Are you kidding me? Their bag men are unbelievable!"

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For the record, that 7-5 Tennessee team finished the regular season 8-4.

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Plus those losses were to-

11-1 Bama
11-1 OU
10-2 Florida
And the Pigs.

And GOOD pre-suspension Florida (who railroaded Ole Miss).

in either scenario both basketball coaches left before they could prove anything more. Gillespie left at the peak of his turn around and then failed miserably at his next several gigs, be that ability or demons. Turge left on the leading edge of his poor recruiting while the gettin' out as good.

Time will tell how Freeze handles his post turn around job and if Sumlin can restock the talent to where he has similar success to his initial billing.

IMO, Sumlin needs to figure out how to manage his players so that he isn't always relying on underclassmen. In the lower tier conferences raw talent can win you a lot of games. In the SEC it takes physical prowess added to honed skills.

I have to wonder how much being a HS coach for years before going the college route has to do with recruiting??

Seems to me a well-known HS coach has personal relationships with his fellow coaches that he can tap to jump start recruiting...at least for the first few years. Also has some familiarity with the players themselves.

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I have to wonder how much being a HS coach for years before going the college route has to do with recruiting??

Seems to me a well-known HS coach has personal relationships with his fellow coaches that he can tap to jump start recruiting...at least for the first few years. Also has some familiarity with the players themselves.

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plus the blind side.....

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I have to wonder how much being a HS coach for years before going the college route has to do with recruiting??

Seems to me a well-known HS coach has personal relationships with his fellow coaches that he can tap to jump start recruiting...at least for the first few years. Also has some familiarity with the players themselves.

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plus the blind side.....

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Yeah but they made Freeze look like a doofus in that film. Sandra Bullock was a better coach.

Recruits have confidence in Hugh Freeze and the direction the program is headed. They get kids and their parents to campus and its beautiful, friendly, and feels like family. Nobody except an occasional drunk frat boy is unhappy with the staff there. When a kid comes to us it feels like a dumpster fire. Everybody pissed at coaches, big ,sprawling, unfriendly campus. Arrogant, defensive coaching staff....feels like a program on the way down. We accuse everyone of cheating, we call other coaches in our own state slime balls . We criticize everybody for having an easy schedule if they are winning, we are hung up on the goings on of a team that we don't even play anymore, delimit admissions to the robotics and debate clubs.What do you expect from an 18 y/o point of view?

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I have to wonder how much being a HS coach for years before going the college route has to do with recruiting??

Seems to me a well-known HS coach has personal relationships with his fellow coaches that he can tap to jump start recruiting...at least for the first few years. Also has some familiarity with the players themselves.

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plus the blind side.....

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Yeah but they made Freeze look like a doofus in that film. Sandra Bullock was a better coach.

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they made him look almost feminine. But my point is, he learned "the recruiting game" from Ed Orgeron. He was hired originally specifically to lure Ohr.

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Recruits have confidence in Hugh Freeze and the direction the program is headed. They get kids and their parents to campus and its beautiful, friendly, and feels like family. Nobody except an occasional drunk frat boy is unhappy with the staff there. When a kid comes to us it feels like a dumpster fire. Everybody pissed at coaches, big ,sprawling, unfriendly campus. Arrogant, defensive coaching staff....feels like a program on the way down. We accuse everyone of cheating, we call other coaches in our own state slime balls . We criticize everybody for having an easy schedule if they are winning, we are hung up on the goings on of a team that we don't even play anymore, delimit admissions to the robotics and debate clubs.What do you expect from an 18 y/o point of view?

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shut up

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I have to wonder how much being a HS coach for years before going the college route has to do with recruiting??

Seems to me a well-known HS coach has personal relationships with his fellow coaches that he can tap to jump start recruiting...at least for the first few years. Also has some familiarity with the players themselves.

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plus the blind side.....

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Yeah but they made Freeze look like a doofus in that film. Sandra Bullock was a better coach.

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they made him look almost feminine. But my point is, he learned "the recruiting game" from Ed Orgeron. He was hired originally specifically to lure Ohr.

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That's how Malzahn got into the college ranks too. Part of the package with a highly rated recruit. Nutt had no choice but to hire him at Arkansas. Disaster ensued.

Come on Ragoo, tell me what is false anywhere in my comment. Truth is ugly sometimes. we have the wrong leader. I've been a season ticket holder for 27 years. Donated lots of money. Sat through lots of ugly games and lots of great ones. I have seen the good and the bad. I have never thought about letting my support go. But when I see that we are regressing and need to make changes to compete where we are, I will let my opinion be know. I have said all along that we recruit well on a Natl. level, just not on an SEC West level. We will be mired where we are until we make a change at the top. Nice guy, great on camera, politically correct choice, but he is not getting it done. We keep making scapegoats out of coordinators but it won't fix he problem. Time will tell...but four years is a lot of time.

your whole rant is a diatribe of woe is me.

....and that from a guy who credits Ole Miss success to "The Blind Side"....although I do agree with your assessment that he is not managing his players and that we are not physical enough to play in this conference. Some of that comes from the air show that has taken over Texas high school football,we don't develop linemen, but it still falls back on the leader at the top for not finding and managing the right guys

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Recruits have confidence in Hugh Freeze and the direction the program is headed. They get kids and their parents to campus and its beautiful, friendly, and feels like family. Nobody except an occasional drunk frat boy is unhappy with the staff there. When a kid comes to us it feels like a dumpster fire. Everybody pissed at coaches, big ,sprawling, unfriendly campus. Arrogant, defensive coaching staff....feels like a program on the way down. We accuse everyone of cheating, we call other coaches in our own state slime balls . We criticize everybody for having an easy schedule if they are winning, we are hung up on the goings on of a team that we don't even play anymore, delimit admissions to the robotics and debate clubs.What do you expect from an 18 y/o point of view?

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Do you know many 18 year olds? That is not at all the feed back I have ever gotten about A&M. I think you are conflating the Zoo w/ A&M as a whole & some idealized Ole Miss.

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....and that from a guy who credits Ole Miss success to "The Blind Side"....although I do agree with your assessment that he is not managing his players and that we are not physical enough to play in this conference. Some of that comes from the air show that has taken over Texas high school football,we don't develop linemen, but it still falls back on the leader at the top for not finding and managing the right guys

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Jeebus! You can be insufferable at times. The Blind Side reference was about Freeze being a HS coach and how that aided in his recruiting pipelines. Further, it was said in jest.

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Recruits have confidence in Hugh Freeze and the direction the program is headed. They get kids and their parents to campus and its beautiful, friendly, and feels like family. Nobody except an occasional drunk frat boy is unhappy with the staff there. When a kid comes to us it feels like a dumpster fire. Everybody pissed at coaches, big ,sprawling, unfriendly campus. Arrogant, defensive coaching staff....feels like a program on the way down. We accuse everyone of cheating, we call other coaches in our own state slime balls . We criticize everybody for having an easy schedule if they are winning, we are hung up on the goings on of a team that we don't even play anymore, delimit admissions to the robotics and debate clubs.What do you expect from an 18 y/o point of view?

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Do you know many 18 year olds? That is not at all the feed back I have ever gotten about A&M. I think you are conflating the Zoo w/ A&M as a whole & some idealized Ole Miss.

I

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I actually have an 18y/o, a 21y/o, and 25 y/o....all boys....two in college and one grad.