So I recently joined The Woodlands Chamber of Commerce and heard they have about 10-15 lots left to sell until The Woodlands is sold out and is land locked for further expansion. There have been some tear down re-builds in Panther Creek (older neighborhood-I think that was this subdivision). Being a real estate investor myself, I told the Chamber Member that has to be somewhat rare for a suburb to have this type play. "Suburb" is apparently offensive as I was quickly corrected that The Woodlands is the Fort Worth to Houston. I'm not sure I buy into that completely but it is remarkable what is taking place in the area. If this materializes, I will definitely be on the lookout for real estate deals in this area as deals have been harder to come by these days.

Being from Atascocita area growing up, I remember Kingwood was suppose to develop the same way (what I heard anyways). I'm not sure why Atascocita/Kingwood area never developed with big businesses in the area like I had hoped growing up- maybe it was poor leadership because the money was certainly there.

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"Suburb" is apparently offensive as I was quickly corrected that The Woodlands is the Fort Worth to Houston.

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HAHAHAHA. I guess it doesn't hurt to dream big. I'll give the woodlands credit that it probably has the most successful business center of all the burbs, but that wasn't hard to beat. The Woodlands is more like the Frisco to Houston

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"Suburb" is apparently offensive as I was quickly corrected that The Woodlands is the Fort Worth to Houston.

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HAHAHAHA. I guess it doesn't hurt to dream big. I'll give the woodlands credit that it probably has the most successful business center of all the burbs, but that wasn't hard to beat. The Woodlands is more like the Frisco to Houston

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I fully endorse this statement.

I was at the Montgomery County Economic Outlook Conference on 2/20 and the 2 guys from the Howard Hughes Corporation discussed the amount of remaining property. It's quite a bit more than 10-15 lots, but this limited to areas in the southern part of the development.

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The Woodlands is the Fort Worth to Houston.

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Um, no it's not. It's the northern Sugar Land. And that's not a bad thing. The Woodlands doesn't really want the problems that come with being a proper city.

For the sake of the argument, I'm calling a proper city one who's has a broad based economy is driven from commerce in it's boundaries and immediate area. Both Sugar Land and The Woodlands have artificially high median incomes because of surrounding businesses. For instance, if a manager in a refinery lives in Sugar Land but the plant is in Houston and most of the workers live in Houston, it is Houston that captures the complete economic activity, not just Sugar Land. Fort Worth has commerce and industry that meets that requirement, though being near Dallas does help.

A side discussion would be if Austin is a proper city. With so much of the city being driven by government and UT, the Austin of today relies heavily on the economic activity of the rest of the state. I guess it would, but worth noting when people want Houston to be more like Austin.

at some point teardowns on lots in older parts of Grogans Mill and Panther Creek will be a reality for The Woodlands. Some of the neighborhoods closer to the highway are sitting on a goldmine with regards to location but the houses are 40 yrs old and not all the nice to begin with.

Has to be something in the deed restrictions to prevent it I imagine.

JJA79,

I had no idea you were going to that. I wanted to go but it was sold out. Any big/interesting news or timelines on the old Camp Strake property?

I would assume it's safe to say now.

There was an article about this specific issue in the community newspaper, probably about a year ago. IIRC, there is nothing in the deeds and restrictions to prevent tear downs and/or combining of lots, and the gist of the article was that residents should expect to start seeing this in the older areas of Grogan's Mill in the next few years. However, a lot of the area in question is very prone to flooding (which is part of the reason why many homes over there are in such disrepair), so I'm not sure that you will see redevelopment at the same level wrt housing density.

This is the article I was thinking of
http://impactnews.com/houston-metro/the-woodlands/older-villages-targeted-for-redevelopment/

more of an exburb

Sugarland has em beat. They have a minor league ball team.

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"Suburb" is apparently offensive as I was quickly corrected that The Woodlands is the Fort Worth to Houston. I'm not sure I buy into that completely but it is remarkable what is taking place in the area.

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A bunch of tech companies are opening or expanding offices in Austin. It's not as dependent on state government as it once was.

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The Woodlands is the Arlington to Houston

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fify

I grew up in Fort Worth. My family's picture window looked out on a beautiful urban skyline, an actual city. When we wanted to drive somewhere, there were actual highways, not bumper to bumper avenues with 50 stoplights. When we went downtown, there was an actual downtown, not a water fountain surrounded by expensive chain restaurants. When we went into the city schools, there were actual black and latino people - I'm sure the Woodlands Chamber members would love to send their children to Dunbar, Northside, Poly, or Eastern Hills. You know, the kinds of schools they have in actual cities.

Grew up in FW too, but have been in Houston for 9 years. That idea is laughable. The other thing that cities have is culture and identity that distinguish them from other cities. The Woodlands is Houston with pine trees and higher gas bills.

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at some point teardowns on lots in older parts of Grogans Mill and Panther Creek will be a reality for The Woodlands. Some of the neighborhoods closer to the highway are sitting on a goldmine with regards to location but the houses are 40 yrs old and not all the nice to begin with.

Has to be something in the deed restrictions to prevent it I imagine.

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This is happening right now. We sold our home in Grogan's Mill in October and the developer plans to tear down the home to build a larger new one when we move out. He's been buying homes in the neighborhood and construction has already begun on one of them. Pretty wild to watch a home get torn down in just a few days.

Initially they wanted to turn two lots into one, but The Woodlands denied that request. These will be nearly zero-lot line homes, but very nice build outs.

These older neighborhoods don't have established HOA's, so no deed restrictions to prevent it.

If you've got the capital to expend on flipping older homes in the Woodlands either via tear-downs or gutting & updating older homes there's got to be a great market there.

As for Kingwood/Atascocita not doing the same thing I think it's 2-fold:
1) as Old Humble predates all that development in Kingwood, most of Atascocita, and the Woodlands by about 60 years at a minimum they simply didn't have the stringent master-planned deed recs or "zoning" of the Woodlands. Thus you see a lot more older, run-down areas. They didn't keep up the cachet of the area by essentially locking out the LOLpoors the way the Woodlands did from the jump.

2) Kingwood never wanted the large scale retail and office/commercial development we've seen in the Woodlands. That in particular was the brilliance of Mitchell's plans- he set aside large areas for commercial only that would be immediately adjacent to 45. Kingwood actively prohibited this until it was too late. Mitchell knew they'd reach a critical mass point of residential development with an educated population that large employers would eventually make the decision to locate there. I believe Anadarko was the first in '98 and the dominoes just keep falling.

What neighborhood?

It amazes me how big of houses they are putting on lots these days, in East Shore especially. Seven figure houses on postage stamp lots. I pay that much and I at least want some semblance of privacy.

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I was at the Montgomery County Economic Outlook Conference on 2/20 and the 2 guys from the Howard Hughes Corporation discussed the amount of remaining property. It's quite a bit more than 10-15 lots, but this limited to areas in the southern part of the development.

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I believe this is in the Woodlands proper that's largely built out. There are large areas referred to as "The Woodlands" but are actually outside the official boundaries.

For example, Carlton Woods, Auburn Lakes, and a couple other areas have Woodlands mailing addresses and are considered "the Woodlands" but are beyond the geographical boundaries.

You are partially correct...Carlton Woods and Carlton Woods Creekside are in The Woodlands (by "in The Woodlands" I mean residents in those areas pay taxes to the township). Creekside and May Valley are also in The Woodlands (but are Tomball and Magnolia ISD, respectively). Auburn Lakes and Augusta Pines (to the south) are not in The Woodlands and are in Klein ISD. Jacob's Reserve and Shenandoah to the north and Harpers Landing to the north and east of 45 are also not in The Woodlands but are zoned to Woodlands schools in Conroe ISD.

Harper's Landing is formally part of The Woodlands.

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Harper's Landing is formally part of The Woodlands.

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Is it? Didn't know that...learn something new everyday! They are kind of getting the short end of the stick over there, though, if they are paying township taxes. That area really doesn't fit with the image of the rest of The Woodlands.

The deed restrictions are enforced by the township. The old neighborhood HOA's were dissolved and their enforcement powers were ceded over.

So Summerwood no longer had a "Woodlands like" atmosphere?

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Sugarland has em beat. They have a minor league ball team.

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I don't know the latest, but the Astros were talking about bringing their AAA team down to just North of the Woodlands.

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quote:Harper's Landing is formally part of The Woodlands.

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Is it? Didn't know that...learn something new everyday! They are kind of getting the short end of the stick over there, though, if they are paying township taxes. That area really doesn't fit with the image of the rest of The Woodlands.

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It is hard to jump a freeway. Kingwood didn't have much luck with this either.

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Auburn Lakes, and a couple other areas have Woodlands mailing addresses and are considered "the Woodlands" but are beyond the geographical boundaries.

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To my knowledge, Auburn Lakes has always had a Spring address (77389). They've tried to market themselves as a neighborhood with the benefits of the Woodlands at a lower price.

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Auburn Lakes, and a couple other areas have Woodlands mailing addresses and are considered "the Woodlands" but are beyond the geographical boundaries

To my knowledge, Auburn Lakes has always had a Spring address (77389). They've tried to market themselves as a neighborhood with the benefits of the Woodlands at a lower price.

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This is sort of correct...Auburn Lakes has always had a Spring address, but it is not part of The Woodlands (although, Creekside, which is in The Woodlands is also 77389 and 77375).

However, "close to the The Woodlands at a lower price" is no longer true...the real estate prices in Auburn Lakes are most definitely keeping pace with The Woodlands proper. I just saw a 2400 sq ft home built in '03 on the Auburn Lakes golf course listed for $450k...that price per square foot is on par with a similar sized house that is on/near the Palmer Course in The Woodlands (although, those houses are just a good ten years or more older). Auburn Lakes isn't really less expensive than The Woodlands, it's just newer.

I graduated from The Woodlands HS. I currently live on NW Houston. I have never heard it referred to as the Fort Worth of Houston.

Auburn Lakes/Augusta Pines aren't in the Woodlands, but the homeowners there refer to it as the Woodlands. It is technically in Spring, and zoned to Klein ISD.

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So Summerwood no longer had a "Woodlands like" atmosphere?

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Never said it did.

And no matter how hard you try I won't be sending you a rent check for the space I seem to occupy in your skull.

There's a big difference between wanting to move a minor league team (especially a AAA team) and actually making it happen.

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It is technically in Spring, and zoned to Klein ISD.

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The part that has always struck me as weird is that much (if not most) of the Woodlands is technically Spring (at least according to MCAD).

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There's a big difference between wanting to move a minor league team (especially a AAA team) and actually making it happen.

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Yup, the astros currently don't own a AAA team. OKC was sold to the Dodgers ownership so they arent leaving anytime soon. The Astros AAA affiliate is now Fresno. Perhaps they can be bought out and Crane can move them down.

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JJA79,

I had no idea you were going to that. I wanted to go but it was sold out. Any big/interesting news or timelines on the old Camp Strake property?

I would assume it's safe to say now.

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We were a sponsor. Give me a call and I'll tell you what I know. I may have one of the info packets left.

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Sugarland has em beat. They have a minor league ball team.

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Houston has a minor league team too.

Finn the presenter was president of Howard Hughes Corp. He was speaking only to remaining are within the Woodlands proper. Other presenters addressed some significant new developments coming online outside but near to the Woodlands.

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Auburn Lakes, and a couple other areas have Woodlands mailing addresses and are considered "the Woodlands" but are beyond the geographical boundaries

To my knowledge, Auburn Lakes has always had a Spring address (77389). They've tried to market themselves as a neighborhood with the benefits of the Woodlands at a lower price.

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This is sort of correct...Auburn Lakes has always had a Spring address, but it is not part of The Woodlands (although, Creekside, which is in The Woodlands is also 77389 and 77375).

However, "close to the The Woodlands at a lower price" is no longer true...the real estate prices in Auburn Lakes are most definitely keeping pace with The Woodlands proper. I just saw a 2400 sq ft home built in '03 on the Auburn Lakes golf course listed for $450k...that price per square foot is on par with a similar sized house that is on/near the Palmer Course in The Woodlands (although, those houses are just a good ten years or more older). Auburn Lakes isn't really less expensive than The Woodlands, it's just newer.

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I'm not claiming to be an expert on the boundaries, I just know there's a fair number of neighborhoods which identify themselves as being in "the Woodlands" when they're actually outside the formal boundaries.